Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  

RMZ450 or CRF450

Recommended Posts

My dad is getting back into mx and can't decide on the rmz or the crf. comments would be appreciated. I'm to tired to use the search button right know so please don't flame.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Whats his ability? Experience? What does he intend to do with the motorcycle? Trail? Moto?

Ive ridden both bikes back to back on a motocross track.(Both were 06 models) I preferred the CRF. The power was broader and it had more over-rev. I felt more connected to the bike and what it was doing in turns. The power of the RMZ with nice but short. I'm sure that could be remedied with a pipe or porting. Out of the box, Id take the CRF. You cant argue with success.

realistically, you could win on either bike.

:thumbsup:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Whats his ability? Experience? What does he intend to do with the motorcycle? Trail? Moto?

Ive ridden both bikes back to back on a motocross track.(Both were 06 models) I preferred the CRF. The power was broader and it had more over-rev. I felt more connected to the bike and what it was doing in turns. The power of the RMZ with nice but short. I'm sure that could be remedied with a pipe or porting. Out of the box, Id take the CRF. You cant argue with success.

realistically, you could win on either bike.

:thumbsup:

Ditto that, I rode an 06 CRF and RMZ back to back on a motocross track yesterday. Both bikes are very good and better at some things that the other. It would come down to preference and what your dad is looking for. Here are a few comparisons from my 30 years riding experience.

RMZ positives

Corners better than the CRF, it will cut a line like no bike I have ever ridden.

Power is low in the band, better supercross powerband than the CRF.

4 speed gearbox, don't listen to magazines the 4 speed is the best gearbox for motocross hands down.

RMZ minuses

Seat height is very tall, minus for me because I'm short.

Power also a minus because it's all low and mid, no overrev for outdoor tracks.

CRF positives

Power, better overall powerband for everything use

Suspension feels better

Seat height, since I'm on the short side.

CRF minuses

5 speed felt in between gears on some turns and tracks.

Go to the Midwest forum here on Thumpertalk. We just did a joint ride to compare all the new bikes. They are all very very good. It really does come down to personal preference and what you want. Every single one of them was better than all others at some things, and worse at others.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A completely different take:

My next bike will probably be a Suzuki.

Here's why; The way American Honda has treated Danny "Magoo" Chandler and David Bailey is hideous. Both of these guys could have used some financial help and Bailey right now is in some pretty serious trouble and Honda couldnt any care less. Also, the way those A-holes treated Magoo when he approached them about funding a saftey tour. If they were going to say no, thats fine, just do it in a professional manner. They treated Magoo like he was just some idiot that wasnt worth thier time.

Both of these guys delivered greatly for Honda. The deserve better. Therefore, I'l buy a Suzuki next time.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Being this is the Honda Forum, I'll add a pro suzuki note.

Last year I had my first and only CRF 450. liked the bike, the power felt good, but was hard for me to get connected with it. If you think the RMZ does not have outdoor power, I was racing at Honey lake, and was pinned on my CRF with WB exhaust, and running race gas, and was blown off the track by a box stock RMZ going up the hill. I know rider ability has a lot to do with this, but this guy is my level rider, that I can beat anytime.

Next info is the transmission. I rode KTM before the honda and loved the positive feeling 4 speeds and grabbed lots of hole shots, and had no problem with top speed for motocross. The Honda transmission was sketchy to say the least. lots of missed gears. the worst was a year ago May, I was riding on my home practice track http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v605/motomandan/Hometrack005.jpg and my bike popped out of 2nd at the top of the jump face. I broke two vertabrae in my neck, tore ligs in my shoulder, and broke a rib.

I sold the CRF and bought a 06 RMZ. It has tons of power that gets to the ground. Easy to holeshot on. very positive transmission. feels lighter and turns like it's on rails. I guess the best comparison for top end, is the Washougal up hill, so far, I have not been passed. This is hands down for me, the best bike I have had in the last 10 years. I will not by another Honda. The quality is sub par compared to the RMZ.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

thanks for the replies. I guess we might go with the rmz. We will be doing a little bit of everything when it comes to riding. (dunes, woods, tracks, ect.)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If your CRF was getting passed uphill by an RMZ 450 your bike must've had a bad engine. I mean seriously, the CRF makes MORE power and torque plus an 8 mph higher top speed, 86mph vs. 78mph. Maybe your tire was spinning the whole way up. Sorry to hear about your crash, though....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
A completely different take:

My next bike will probably be a Suzuki.

Here's why; The way American Honda has treated Danny "Magoo" Chandler and David Bailey is hideous. Both of these guys could have used some financial help and Bailey right now is in some pretty serious trouble and Honda couldnt any care less. Also, the way those A-holes treated Magoo when he approached them about funding a saftey tour. If they were going to say no, thats fine, just do it in a professional manner. They treated Magoo like he was just some idiot that wasnt worth thier time.

Both of these guys delivered greatly for Honda. The deserve better. Therefore, I'l buy a Suzuki next time.

This is completely wrong. Honda has, in the past and during his recent medical challenge, donated money to David Bailey. This isn't one of those "look at me, I'm doing the right thing" photo opps for Honda.

As much as I love Magoo, Honda owes him absolutely nothing. He was injured long after he rode for Team Honda.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
If your CRF was getting passed uphill by an RMZ 450 your bike must've had a bad engine. I mean seriously, the CRF makes MORE power and torque plus an 8 mph higher top speed, 86mph vs. 78mph. Maybe your tire was spinning the whole way up. Sorry to hear about your crash, though....

Not comparing, but RC himself couldn't go even 60 up the Honey Lake hill, so top speed isn't a factor.. And if you have any experience in motocross, you should know horse power on a dyno doesn't mean much. It's how much horse power gets to the ground. I think with street tires and a eighth mile strip, the Honda may win. I didn't say the Honda had a bad motor. the Suzuki hooks up and keeps the power to the ground so much better than my honda did, that in dirt, the suzuki is faster. It is definitely easier to ride, and is less tiring then the Honda.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
This is completely wrong. Honda has, in the past and during his recent medical challenge, donated money to David Bailey. This isn't one of those "look at me, I'm doing the right thing" photo opps for Honda.

As much as I love Magoo, Honda owes him absolutely nothing. He was injured long after he rode for Team Honda.

Read this:

An Open Letter From Danny Magoo:

Recently, I have received more phone calls and emails from people alerting me to new spinal chord injuries in our sport than ever before. Riders like up and coming 18 year old national pro Chase Borders have had their dreams shattered due to career ending spinal cord injury. This recent phenomenon coupled with Ernesto Fonseca’s recent paralyzing injury, and the current situation with my friend and fellow wheel chair bound motocross legend David Bailey have finally made this issue so huge and apparent, that I felt something must be publicly said. It is time the industry and especially the bike manufacturers step up and lend a helping hand to the fallen racers who have done so much for this sport.

With the rate of paralysis causing injuries on the rise, the AMA and the factory teams must begin to take some responsibility. This includes a mandatory chest protector and neck roll rule for all professional AMA racing. Safety and good racing must be our number one concern. Being a quadriplegic for over twenty years, I can tell first hand how huge and terrible this issue is. We, as a racing community, must push for sweeping changes from the factories and people running this sport concerning the safety of current riders, and the well-being of riders who have already been hurt.

The other day, I received a call from Goat Brecker inviting me to come down to the Lake Elsinore Grand Prix to help raise money for David Bailey. It seems as a result of David’s busy schedule working for TV and doing motocross schools, that he has developed a very serious pressure sore that will require him to be bed ridden for a minimum of one year. The sore is a result of his chair rubbing against his skin for hours on end everyday. Since David, like myself, has no feeling in the lower half of his body, this problem can go undetected until the sore is out of control. Having spent, at one time, a year and a half bed-ridden with a similar pressure sore, I can attest to the severity of this injury. When I called David to see how he was doing, I was disgusted to find that the man, a multi-time US MX champion, was receiving no help at all from Honda, the company he won all those championships for and continues to represent today. Any sort of help or compensation for riders in David’s situation would be nothing to a huge entity like Honda. Sadly however, they aren’t going to do anything but lead David on. For four years, they have told him he could head up the American Honda amateur support program, a position that David was built for. Four years later, they still offer him no job, no salary, no support. To say I have been treated any differently after my days as a professional racer for them would be a lie. In fact, I feel that Honda regards me as more of a publicity nightmare than an asset with a lot to pass on to the youth of our sport today. They see me, a man in a wheel chair, put there in part because of motorcycles and think all I will do is scare parents away from the sport, when the opposite couldn’t be more true. Through safety awareness, we can create healthy, long-term riders, which means fewer injuries and long-term patrons of the sport.

Some years ago, I wrote up a complete budget proposal and presented it to Honda. My plan was to purchase a wheelchair-ready van and travel to the major races to promote the use of chest protectors, neck rolls and safety in general. On my own, I have convinced many, many parents and kids to start wearing this extra safety gear, which should be mandatory for all riders. The impact people like David and myself could have if we looked professional, and were given a modest budget to get from race to race would be huge. Before my meeting with Honda, I had been representing them at the 24 Hours of Glen Helen race, pitting with Jeff Willow. Due to this, my chair was obviously dirty. When I sat down with the Honda rep and told them my plan, they really didn’t take me seriously at all and really had no intention of helping. The rep asked me if I really thought I could help the kids, and I replied, “Yes, of course. If I look professional like the factory boys do, and I can get around, tell my story, and speak of the importance of safety and responsibility, yes.” He mockingly replied, “Does that mean you are going to wash your wheelchair?” I don’t think I have ever been so insulted. It is quite out of my hands how dirty my chair gets, since I don’t really have the capability to wash it myself, let alone the fact I had spent the last 24 hours at a motorcycle race. Years later, I approached them again to ask for funding for one of my latest projects, a documentary on my life entitled “Magoo: The Story of Danny Chandler,” and again wasn’t taken seriously nor really heard at all. Honda has no intention of giving anything back to the sport that doesn’t directly result in higher profits.

The irresponsibility at the highest levels of professional racing concerning safety has to change. How many more young people must end up like me before some real legislation comes into effect? There is no better way to promote safety than to have the professional ranks start the trend. Just imagine how many kids would be begging their parents for neck protection if Carmichael started wearing it.

Years ago, when I was inducted into the Motocross Hall of Fame, I brought attention to the fact that the carting industry has recently made neck rolls mandatory for all racers. Soon after the legislation went through, the amount of spinal cord related injuries plummeted, as did the cost of insurance for the promoter, thus making the sport less expensive as well as safer. Why has motocross, a much larger sport, not addressed the situation as well?

Those who profit most from the sport must take responsibility to take care, in some capacity, of those already injured, and to do everything possible to prevent future injuries. Motorcycles and the lifestyle that comes with them are a vehicle we use to live life to its absolute fullest, however, the incredible freedom we all get from riding comes with a heavy responsibility to ourselves and especially to the youth of this sport. It is time the voices of injured riders, who have given so much, are heard and supported, and it is time for change.

Go Ride.

Danny “Magoo” Chandler

As transcribed and written by Noah Samson

Between that and Bailey needing money that Honda could quietly donate to get the surgery to probably save his life from a pressure sore thats horribly infected Im pretty disgusted with American Honda.

This doesnt have anything to do with Magoo getting hurt while riding for whom ever...its about respect and consideration.

Personally I believe the Suzuki to be way off par regarding fit finish and reliablility...but I just cant get past the stupid bullshit from Honda...Look at the list that basically run away from Honda..McGrath, RC, Valentino Rossi, Colin Edwards, Kevin Windam (wont ride out of the factory truck)...A couple of those relationships have been mended but its just shitty business in my view....

And for what its worth I tried to send this as a PM to camp just to not highjack/redbeard this thread but it was too big. I didnt see a way to edit it and maintain the context.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I read that letter when it was first released. While I appreciate what Magoo says about safety, I disagree with his position with regards to Honda.

Honda has recently given DB a large amount of money. That fact was released on another board.

Honda does not owe Magoo anything. His idea may or may not have merit. The management at Honda was given the opportunity to bankroll it and they declined.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I read that letter when it was first released. While I appreciate what Magoo says about safety, I disagree with his position with regards to Honda.

Honda has recently given DB a large amount of money. That fact was released on another board.

Honda does not owe Magoo anything. His idea may or may not have merit. The management at Honda was given the opportunity to bankroll it and they declined.

The way they declined is my problem.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I read somewhere that Honda still has Ernesto Fonseca on the payroll today!! They still set his bikes out at the races from what I've seen!! I do believe that the teams should provide some type of disability insurance for the riders!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The way they declined is my problem.

Well, neither of us were there so we don't really know how that went down. To me, it sounds like sour grapes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Well, neither of us were there so we don't really know how that went down. To me, it sounds like sour grapes.

I may agree if Magoo hadnt said that being paralyzed was the best thing that ever happened to him. Seems to me he's got the sour grapes thing pretty well under control with an outlook like that.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Go to the local shops Suzuki and Honda and see who treats you better. Then purchase that brand bike. I do not think the speed difference between them will matter, but support after the sale will be worth much more. They are all very good these days. After you have been riding a long time or your dad purchase the bike that fits you style until then go for dealer support. If the dealer has both sit on them a go with the one that feels better. :thumbsup:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Being this is the Honda Forum, I'll add a pro suzuki note.

Last year I had my first and only CRF 450. liked the bike, the power felt good, but was hard for me to get connected with it. If you think the RMZ does not have outdoor power, I was racing at Honey lake, and was pinned on my CRF with WB exhaust, and running race gas, and was blown off the track by a box stock RMZ going up the hill. I know rider ability has a lot to do with this, but this guy is my level rider, that I can beat anytime.

I've raced that track a lot, in fact I just got back from 2 days of racing there (Saturday MX, Sunday GP) so I feel like I know MX395 pretty well :thumbsup: Horsepower helps on that hill, but suspension and rider ability are huge factors, especially later in the day when it gets really rough. Some people just seem to be better at that particular section than others, even if they're close on other parts of the track. My CRF is bone stock and I blow by people going up that hill all day long, I usually pull a few bike lengths on guys that are as fast or faster than me elsewhere, it just seems like I have that one part really figured out and I don't believe it has anthing to do with a few extra horsepower one way or the other. It's line choice, technique and good suspension.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Reply with:

Sign in to follow this  

×