FrankenXR200

[Owyhee]

XR200 people:

I had a leftover CR500 frame and rear end and XR600 fork in my garage collecting dust. I scammed the DMV for a title for the frame (a good story in itself) and dreamed of sticking an lightly modded XR200 motor in it to make the Ultimate Woods Bike (there isn't really any woods around here but that is how I justified it to myself).

Getting the XR600 fork (1999, new seals and bushings) to make up with the CR500 frame (1995, complete minus fork and motor) was easy. I'm not 100% pleased with the setup but it can wait.

I scored a $150 "running" 1980 XR200 motor and $40 more for the wiring harness, header, shifter, kick starter, and other bits and pieces. As you can see in the pics, there's plenty of room for the motor. It's a touch tall right because the original motor mounts are super tall.

Observations:

1) The header will just sorta barely clear the frame. That's good.

2) The stock tank will not fit. As it is now, the petcock is about 5 inches below the carb, not that it matters because the tank contacts the engine by about a good 5 inches. That will be tough.

3) The carb won't fit. As you can see in the pictures the carb will be right about where the frame is... and the intake boot is on the wrong side. The shock's nitrogen res is in the way of where the intake boot should be (As it is, the shock won't rotate 180 degrees as the tank is in the way).

4) The kickstarter will only rotate about 75 degrees. The CR500's footpeg is higher than the XR200's. My guess is that if I rotate the kickstarter forward I can get more of a kick before the kicker hits the peg.

So anyway, that is where I stand on day one. I'm looking for a stock carb, intake manifold, sprocket cover, and a decomp lever off an XR250/350/500/600 to replace the auto decompressor, and other bits and pieces. If you have spares sitting around the garage I'd like to buy them off you.

Big view

Header clearance

Rear view

Carb clearance.

Thoughts? Ideas?

As an aside, I have no power tools other than a drill and a bench grinder. I'm going to beg/barrow/steal shop time to complete the project.

"O"

[Quick Draw]

That's a nice roller Owyhee. I pictured something a little more beaten up, but that looks like it will be really nice if you get it together. It seems that you have a lot of fabricating in your future... I wish I had the money for a project like this.. You have the opportunity to get pretty creative with this...

[fordfreak300]

Can you us pics of the lower motor mounts?

[husky123]

The carb clearance looks like it may be a tough one. It's almost as if the motor needs to go forward and front end rotated up (back of motor down) for the carb to clear??

But if it works it's going to be bad ass!

[kc_450_X]

There is no room to check your valves either. Nothing that can't be fixed.

[Owyhee]

QD: I'm on a very strict budget. I am allowed only two bikes and this one is my third. My roller cost $700 and the engine, bits, and delivery cost $225.

I've seen early 1990s CR500 rollers for $400. They're out there you just have to drive to get them.

fordfreak300: The stock CR500 motor mounts are still on there. The stock mounts are on the insise of the bottom frame rails, the new ones will have to be on the outside. Of the five mounting points for the XR200 motor, all but the back mount will be pretty easy. There is no frame in the rear to mount the motor to. I may just leave it out?

husky123: I agree that the motor will have to be rotated slightly. When it is set in its new mounts the engine will be 3/4 inch forward and 1/4 inch lower. The farther forward the motor is the better the kick starter will work.

kc_450_X: You're right that checking the valves will be difficult.

"O"

[husky123]

O,

I love it. It's going to be awesome when it's done. With the motor forward and down the carb should work. Great work.

QD: I'm on a very strict budget. I am allowed only two bikes and this one is my third. My roller cost $700 and the engine, bits, and delivery cost $225.

I've seen early 1990s CR500 rollers for $400. They're out there you just have to drive to get them.

fordfreak300: The stock CR500 motor mounts are still on there. The stock mounts are on the insise of the bottom frame rails, the new ones will have to be on the outside. Of the five mounting points for the XR200 motor, all but the back mount will be pretty easy. There is no frame in the rear to mount the motor to. I may just leave it out?

husky123: I agree that the motor will have to be rotated slightly. When it is set in its new mounts the engine will be 3/4 inch forward and 1/4 inch lower. The farther forward the motor is the better the kick starter will work.

kc_450_X: You're right that checking the valves will be difficult.

"O"

[fordfreak300]

Forward and down was what I was thinking, but I couldn't see the bottom to be able to tell if it would work or not. That's going to be an awesome bike.

[Owyhee]

Forward and down was what I was thinking, but I couldn't see the bottom to be able to tell if it would work or not. That's going to be an awesome bike.

I'm pretty excited about it. It'll be everything I like about the XR200 (motor, fuel mileage) without all the things I don't like (fork, shock, wiggly frame, brakes, size, etc).

Current plan is to run a non-o-ring chain and alumnium sprocket (I don't ride in mud), bearing-supported mid-cam, a stock CRF250R muffler, and bore it out a touch and put a high(er) compression piston in it. I'd like to do the Full-zoot 218 kit but my budget won't support that.

I have a Sears gift card from Christmas with a couple hundred bucks on it. My shopping list includes:

1) Angle grinder

2) A hand-held tool with a wire wheel (ideas?)

3) Maybe a welder (a used one)

"O"

[kc_450_X]

I have a Sears gift card from Christmas with a couple hundred bucks on it. My shopping list includes:

1) Angle grinder

2) A hand-held tool with a wire wheel (ideas?)

3) Maybe a welder (a used one)

"O"

I don't know if you have access to an air compressor but Mac tool was having a great deal on die grinders. Only $98 cnd for both.

They are great for grinding steel and come with many different attachments.

[fordfreak300]

a hand held tool with a wire wheel is easy. Get one that fits your drill. I have a bench grinder with a grinding stone on one side and wire wheel on the other. A wire wheel for my drill, and wire wheels for my dremel tool. I use them all. I used a dremel to port and polish my head. The throttle response was soo much snappier and the rpms were so much smoother. I also port matched the intake boot and the head so they mated up with out any ridges overlapping. It helps to increase air flow and helps keep the air flow from stalling and having to make a hard turn over the ridge. I straighted out the intake runner to improve air flow, mainly on the short side radius. I also did the same on the exhaust runner. It is simple to do and remove very little metal. The exhaust is the hardest as you have to also polish it smooth. Great fun. Keep posting up pics as you go along so we can see what all you are doing.

[Owyhee]

a hand held tool with a wire wheel is easy. Get one that fits your drill. I have a bench grinder with a grinding stone on one side and wire wheel on the other. A wire wheel for my drill, and wire wheels for my dremel tool.

I ended up getting a Makita (spelling?) hand-held grinder. It came with a tile wheel and a metal grinding wheel. I got two cut-off wheels too.

The cut off wheel worked really well once it got broken in. I've hacked off the lower four motor mounts and ground two down to the frame. At some point I split a knuckle and bled all over the frame. That's it for tonite.

Kc_450_X: I don't have access to a air tool set or compressor at home. I really wish I did though!

Here's the frame minus motor mounts:

Here's the motor as it will sit (it is lined up with the rear sprocket):

Now there is no more header clearance (at least with the 1980 header, I think a later header may fit):

No room for the carb... I'll have to be creative here:

Shot from above showing lack of carb clearance but it looks like the valves can be adjusted with the motor in the frame:

That's all for now.

"O"

[fordfreak300]

This is going to turn into a big but fun project considring your lack of tools. But this gives you an excuse to buy more tools. If you had a welder you could make your own intake and weld it up. That would allow yuo to route it where it needed to be for carb clearance. The stock intake is not straight. It comes out then curves in, you may be ok there. Do you have the carb and intake so you can trial fit them? My header pipe does not appear to come out as far as yours does in the front on that first bend, after it connects to the motor. I have a supper trap exhaust. You might b able to take that bike to a muffler shop and have them customize the header by shortening it and rebending it to fit. Also radiator shops can weld just about anything so anything you need welded can usually be done there for a cheaper price.

[Owyhee]

...and just for the record, an XR200 motor with no carb, header, intake manifold or oil but with kickstarter (the old steel one) and a shifter weighs 57lbs on my Super Accurate Bathroom Scale.

I weighed it with the motor on the scale and again with me holding the motor on the scale.

"O"

[CharlieT]

Yo....Big "O" Finally gettin'er done, eh?

You really need to work on the rare motor mount. I only used a rear and front mount, not a lowermount. Also used the top mount on the head.:

I also relocated the foot pegs lower to get mmore swing on the kickstart. Actaully fit me better and was more comfortable with them relocated.

[Owyhee]

This is going to turn into a big but fun project considring your lack of tools. But this gives you an excuse to buy more tools. If you had a welder you could make your own intake and weld it up. That would allow yuo to route it where it needed to be for carb clearance. The stock intake is not straight. It comes out then curves in, you may be ok there. Do you have the carb and intake so you can trial fit them? My header pipe does not appear to come out as far as yours does in the front on that first bend, after it connects to the motor. I have a supper trap exhaust. You might b able to take that bike to a muffler shop and have them customize the header by shortening it and rebending it to fit. Also radiator shops can weld just about anything so anything you need welded can usually be done there for a cheaper price.

I'm going to use my "Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance" mechanical theory to figure things out once installation begins.

I have a running 2002 XR200 that I'm going to use as a test mule for the engine to make sure it runs (2002 engine out, 1980 engine in) as well robbing the 2002 for parts now and then to see if the electrical bits I got with thr 1980 motor work.

Last night I peeked inside the top end with a flashlight. The cam actually looks okay... a llittle burnt... but there is a touch of rust on some of the rockerbox. Also, the exhaust valve is caked with carbon. I'll probably end up doing a valve guide/new valves/bearing cam/rings while I'm in there.

The header from the 1980 motor is different than the newer ones. For starters, it is cast and the new one is light gauge steel. Second, you're right, the bend is different. The newer headers don't stick out as far and wrap closer in to the engine.

Yo....Big "O" Finally gettin'er done, eh?

You really need to work on the rare motor mount. I only used a rear and front mount, not a lowermount. Also used the top mount on the head.:

I also relocated the foot pegs lower to get mmore swing on the kickstart. Actaully fit me better and was more comfortable with them relocated.

There seems to be five mounting points for the motor:

1) The back of the head

2) Front of motor

3) Front of motor

4) Rear bottom

5) Rear top of case

#2 and #3 are really one mount. I'm not sure if I could hook up #5. There isn't and frame to attach the mount to. I think on the right it's 8 inches laterally and 3 inches back to the frame. I may be able to build something up from the bottom. There is an "X" in the rear of the frame rails that looks pretty sturdy.

I held up the 1980's kick starter to the 2002's kick starter and noticed a huge difference. The 1980's kicker is longer and rotates from the top in a vertical axis. The 2002's kicker rotates from the side in a vertical axis. Currently, the kickstarter hits the brake petal at about 75 degrees (or less). The 2002's kicker pivots out and around and the bend sets the lever father away from the frame. I'm pretty sure that it will clear the brake pedal. Also, the current brake pedal is bent... and sticking out more than it should. It's alumnium and looks to have been bent and bent back many times... it has stress cracks all the way around it in places.

"O"

[vanillaice]

If you chop the cradle and drop the engine down will the sprockets be ok?

[Owyhee]

If you chop the cradle and drop the engine down will the sprockets be ok?

Yes, I could. As it is now, the sprocket lines up 100% both vertically and horizontally. I'm not sure about how it looks fore/aft since I'm not 100% sure where the motor will sit.

With the new motor mounts I guesstimate that there will be 1/16th of an inch of space between the engine and frame rails and between 1/16 to 1/4 inch between the head and the top rail depending on the tilt and placement of the motor.

"O"

[CharlieT]

Don't have a better pic, but if you look, mu rear moun isn't realy attached directly to the frame. The mounting locations on the gnien are actually a fair distance from the frame. I made wo plates, one to fit each side of the motor, and including both upper and lower rear mounts, the welded in a plate between those two, bracing/joining the outer plates, it then is mounted using the rear swingarm mounting points and swing arm bolt. SO it is not acutally securely boltd to the frame in the rear. IN fact, if you remove the top mount bolt and the two front bolts, you can pivot the whole motor and rear mount around the swingarm bolt. However, once it is bolted in both fronts and top, it isn't going anywhere.

Can't recall right this minute, but It seems I found a carb mount for thatfit the 200 that hd a different angle and then flipped it over to get the right angle to clear the suspenions, etc on my bike? Is your manifold straigh or angled?

[Owyhee]

Don't have a better pic, but if you look, mu rear moun isn't realy attached directly to the frame. The mounting locations on the gnien are actually a fair distance from the frame. I made wo plates, one to fit each side of the motor, and including both upper and lower rear mounts, the welded in a plate between those two, bracing/joining the outer plates, it then is mounted using the rear swingarm mounting points and swing arm bolt. SO it is not acutally securely boltd to the frame in the rear. IN fact, if you remove the top mount bolt and the two front bolts, you can pivot the whole motor and rear mount around the swingarm bolt. However, once it is bolted in both fronts and top, it isn't going anywhere.

I just saw the pic you posted in your post above. It was blocked at work... not that I do TT at work...

That is pretty clever... coming up from the bottom...

Can't recall right this minute, but It seems I found a carb mount for thatfit the 200 that hd a different angle and then flipped it over to get the right angle to clear the suspenions, etc on my bike? Is your manifold straigh or angled?

I don't have a manifold or a carb right now. The one on my 2002 is straight more or less. Where the end of the intake manifold is.... is the frame. I'm going to have to do some cutting and pasting there.

Today I took the rocker box off and tried to get the head off. I managed to snap off one of the bolts holding the CDI on. I'll try and find someone with an EZ-Out sooner or later.

The top end looks pretty good. The cam and rocker arm faces aren't scored or burnt.

How do I get the CDI off the cam?????? There is a bolt on the end of the cam... when it turn it the engine turns over. I imagine that if I can stop the engine from turning I can get the bolt out... does that get it off the cam? I'm puzzled.

Help!

Also, I finished grinding off the old motor mounts.

"O"