In the Dirt Rider 08'250f shootout....

[grunkthump]

Jimmy Lewis alludes to the fact that he liked the 07' better than the 08'...anyone else catch that?? your thoughts??

[bboyce]

He need to learn to short shift, or know that even though the top end may not have the same hit as the mid does...there is defanetly more beans then the 07 had. ?

[btc20mx]

people still read dirt rider?

[BazookaJoe]

Yeah, I saw that and I think that could be took a bunch of ways. Jimmy is a FAST rider and maybe he's looking for a bit more top end scream but the 08 has more mid range pull and maybe not as much top end holler. Perhaps Jimmy has to say something.

I really wish these magazine guys would quit being so picky about the box stock engine set ups. A set of cams makes a real difference and are such an easy drop-in modification which actually costs less than a noisy barker pipe.

btw, grunk, you guys with jobs annoy me these days.

[SUnruh]

ah yes a weak top end.

what does he think about the exhaust valve shafts on the red diesel pig getting smaller and will require more frequent valve guides then they did previousally?

oh, was that about the powerband? my bad. ?

[bboyce]

ah yes a weak top end.

what does he think about the exhaust valve shafts on the red diesel pig getting smaller and will require more frequent valve guides then they did previousally?

oh, was that about the powerband? my bad. ?

Agreed. How can they praise the build quality on the honda when in their long haul tests they say the CRF eats through clutchs and needs a top end every 25 hours? How does that make sense.

Take engine life/reliability and Yamaha would be right up there, probably even putting KTM near the top too.

[jlewis]

For me the Yamaha did get a little more power in the mid and I didn't think it lost anything on the top. It feels flatter becuase the mid is so impressive. This somehow made the bike harder for me to ride by somehow upsetting the handling just a little bit. The bike really starts ripping a little too early for me compared to last year. These bikes are all so close that something as small as that can take a bike from the top to the bottom. The 2007 YZ would have felt a little weak in this comparison, I'm guessing.

We've never long hauled a CRF250R that I recall BTW.

[andrew_driscoll]

Take engine life/reliability and Yamaha would be right up there, probably even putting KTM near the top too.

For sure.... those 2003 ktm 450 sx's that had to have the upgraded heads to replace the too aggressive cams and soft valves, not to mention the clutch baskets sure were reliable ?

I've had the honda, ktm and yamaha this year. The honda is clearly the best build quality wise. Of couse, it could do with stronger valves and a better clutch basket.. but to stand there and look at it, it's a hell of a lot nicer finish.

Or you could get a KTM and hold your shrouds on with wood screws

If the yammy is the clear winner for you, why care what the mags say anyway ? I mean I'm sure you rode all brands back to back before making your decision to by the YZ's, otherwise what you're saying would just be silly owners pride

[billyo]

For me the Yamaha did get a little more power in the mid and I didn't think it lost anything on the top. It feels flatter becuase the mid is so impressive. This somehow made the bike harder for me to ride by somehow upsetting the handling just a little bit. The bike really starts ripping a little too early for me compared to last year. These bikes are all so close that something as small as that can take a bike from the top to the bottom. The 2007 YZ would have felt a little weak in this comparison, I'm guessing.

We've never long hauled a CRF250R that I recall BTW.

I agree. i put a wiseco 13.5:1 single ring piston in my 07. it woke up some bottom but the gain i felt was mostly in the mid. for me it was a well worthy upgrade. i can see your point that with the added mid hit, the bike can stand up easier on the exit of a turn or rut...

however IMO, the 07 as well as the 08 dont have much top end overrev. the yz250f motor revs up very quickly but up top it seems to go flat very abruptly like hitting a wall. sounds like a rev limiter but its not. its not the motor. its the pipe. its very choked up, quiet though. threw a GP pc full system on it. gave it even more mid and awesome top end overrev. bike rips now...?

i know the yzf is not the sharpest looking bike in its class but its an excellent reliable functional motocross bike....does everything well without any drama...

[av]

For me the Yamaha did get a little more power in the mid and I didn't think it lost anything on the top. It feels flatter because the mid is so impressive. This somehow made the bike harder for me to ride by somehow upsetting the handling just a little bit. The bike really starts ripping a little too early for me compared to last year. These bikes are all so close that something as small as that can take a bike from the top to the bottom. The 2007 YZ would have felt a little weak in this comparison, I'm guessing.

We've never long hauled a CRF250R that I recall BTW.

Hi Jimmy,

Why doesn't your magazine do "long haul/reliability" tests with these 4-stroke 250Fs (Yamaha, Honda, Suzuki, Kawasaki, KTM, Husky, etc.)? We would like to see which bike, in stock form, would run with the least amount of parts replacement within, say 100 engine clock hrs? If that's too long, then how about 4 days of constant beating/riding? New bikes are nice, but most of us can't afford the cost for constant engine parts replacement (head, valves, etc.) - this test would really benefit your readers and not just the typical how NEW stock bikes perform/look review/article. Then we'll see what I believe is VERY important to the consumer, i.e., the "reliability" test.

The only thing you should change is the oil, oil filter and air filter. Log all problems found with each bike. Don't change anything else to the bike/engine/suspension, etc. since this WILL BE a long haul test. This test should be done yearly too.

That's my feedback for Dirt Rider, hopefully you will do what the public wants to see and I believe the reliability issue has been raised many times on TT.

What do you think of my proposal/request?

[SUnruh]

i'm sure he's afraid of the picture they would have to take when they disassemble the bike and layout all the parts used.

16 valves, 12 valve guides, 3 cranks and a partridge in a pear tree. ?

[av]

i'm sure he's afraid of the picture they would have to take when they disassemble the bike and layout all the parts used.

16 valves, 12 valve guides, 3 cranks and a partridge in a pear tree.

I'm thinking more like if the bike breaks, i.e., not ridable for whatever reason, it's out of "contention" for this "last bike standing" test/award - we're NOT talking about 1 day of riding but a "long haul" test... ?

[Bigbird]

I thought DR was doing a long haul test on the '07 WR250F. I haven't seen any write-ups on it. Did that test get canned?

[250f canuck]

We've never long hauled a CRF250R that I recall BTW.

The October '06 issue says different. Test update #2 for Sean Finley's long haul '06 CRF250R. Full top end job at 45hrs (piston, valves, all that jazz). Suspension was done at the same time. New clutch plates also (doesn't say when).

[mxmaddman]

Yea, who gives a rats @$$ about a few rips around a track? After all we are stuck with our 7 thousand dollar purchases for more than a few laps. Longevity test are the most overlooked and single most important test. All magazines neglect to mention that part of a bike. Normally I don't really care about the opinions of a one day test ride. Stock the bikes are so close in comparison a simple suspension adjustment could make one better than the other. I want to see which one last longer. They should take them all to a track everyday for a month, pull them apart at the end and check the wear.

[MR WRite]

I would not base my purchase on one long term test. I did use the valuable feedback and longterm experiences of the owners on thumpertalk to help drive my decision as to what bikes to make my mules. So thanks to all you longterm testers out there staring at your screens, keep that information coming

[crf230ripper]

I would not base my purchase on one long term test. I did use the valuable feedback and longterm experiences of the owners on thumpertalk to help drive my decision as to what bikes to make my mules. So thanks to all you longterm testers out there staring at your screens, keep that information coming

Who needs magazine reviews to base your bike purchase off of? We have thumpertalk!!! nothing much else needed IMO

On one other note, I just read an article in one of the mags that was doing tests on 450's or 250's I can't remember (I will find it and quote it) but they stated right in the article that for the last several years Honda had been winning the shootouts and that any other magazine that didn't have honda winning were lying!!!!......then they went on to say that Hondas out of all the bikes they kept over the years and continue to ride spent the least amount of time in the shop!!! It was all in the first paragraph of the opening to the article. Like I said I will find it and what mag it was and post it when i do. I am a YZ 250F owner and @ some point will look to buy a 450, So the article stuck out to me when I read it. Maybe someone else recalls readin it????

[honda88]

Hey I am a honda guy and I loved my 04 crf250 and it held up well for the 4 years I owned it but I did go thru 4 sets of valves the fix was SS valves. My friend has an 03 yz250f that has never had to replace valves and I have seen and herd many other stories like this from other yamaha owners. Thats why I just got an 08 yz250f. I take what tha mags say with a grain of salt. I just like looking at purttey pictures,LOL. I love to wrench but at my stage of life I want to ride I want to ride I want to ride.

[RobinWatson]

I agree. i put a wiseco 13.5:1 single ring piston in my 07. it woke up some bottom but the gain i felt was mostly in the mid. for me it was a well worthy upgrade. i can see your point that with the added mid hit, the bike can stand up easier on the exit of a turn or rut...

however IMO, the 07 as well as the 08 dont have much top end overrev. the yz250f motor revs up very quickly but up top it seems to go flat very abruptly like hitting a wall. sounds like a rev limiter but its not. its not the motor. its the pipe. its very choked up, quiet though. threw a GP pc full system on it. gave it even more mid and awesome top end overrev. bike rips now...

i know the yzf is not the sharpest looking bike in its class but its an excellent reliable functional motocross bike....does everything well without any drama...

Thats the first time Ive seen anyone say exactly what I thought about the yzf. I had an 07 sxf 250 last year and a friend the 07 yzf. The ktm would chew up the yzf motor wise.....until he put an arrow pipe on his and then i think the yzf was a little stronger than a stock sxf.

But in saying that his yzf looked more tired after 50 hours than the ktm did with over 100!

Im now on a kxf 450, i think the pipe might be doin something similar to the yzf, but you dont need to rev a 450 so it doesnt matter!

[grunkthump]

"Last Bike Standing"!! I like it!! GREAT idea!! you get that Jimmy??