The KTM 200 Club

[gmoss357]

Wanted to create a place where we can gather our info about our beloved 200's. Myself am new to the club and have been drawing information from those of you experienced 200 owners. My goal is to have this information in one place, where we can post jetting, susp, tips and tricks, and other pertinent info related to this bike. I know some of it will cross over, but the 200 is a little different from it's bigger brothers. Provide your personal information concerning setup, links to other threads or webpages, changes made and results, etc.If this goes well, would like to see it get stickied.

[Firecracker]

I haven't done that much to mine. Just replaced stuff that's broken over the years, and the suspension.

I do like my X-bushing. I also used a thinner base gasket on my last engine rebuild, but not so much as to make a big difference. I geared it down a little, since I think its' a bit tall from the factory--if I were buying another one, I'd get the XC over the XC-W now. A friend who has a MXC is going to swap bikes with me from time to time to see what we think of each others' bikes. Hmm, oh and I bought an FMF pipe to replace the dented and abused factory one.

So, not much for bling or mods, but the bike really doesn't need much IMO.

[gmoss357]

I'll start. To start, a couple of links to recent threads I started on the 200. Feel free to add to this.

Jetting on my 05

Comparison info with pics.

I bought this bike used, jetting was as follows:

Sudco DCK needle (3rd clip)

185 M

45 P

AS - 1 turn out.

temps in the 40's

Elev - 800'

Oil mix @ 44:1 Motul 710

Bike ran out good, but was spoogin some. Tried leaning it out some, went to a 182M, 2nd clip, AS - 1.5, temps in the 30's. Bike started idling rough and develped a lean knock, plug was tan though. Man the 200 is finicky. raised the clip to 3rd and set the AS @ .5 turns out. Running good, but I know it is too lean at this setting, need a better winter setup. Next I will be raising the needle to the 4th clip and adjusting the AS to see where I am. Pics to come.

[gmoss357]

I haven't done that much to mine. Just replaced stuff that's broken over the years, and the suspension.

I do like my X-bushing. I also used a thinner base gasket on my last engine rebuild, but not so much as to make a big difference. I geared it down a little, since I think its' a bit tall from the factory--if I were buying another one, I'd get the XC over the XC-W now. A friend who has a MXC is going to swap bikes with me from time to time to see what we think of each others' bikes. Hmm, oh and I bought an FMF pipe to replace the dented and abused factory one.

So, not much for bling or mods, but the bike really doesn't need much IMO.

Great, what about a link to the X bushing, for future readers?

Your jetting?

[Firecracker]

Great, what about a link to the X bushing, for future readers?

Your jetting?

Oh geez. I'd have to look and see what's in my kit to tell what's in my bike, I was doing some tinkering last fall. 38 or 40 pilot, 168 main, have to check which needle and a/s setting ...

Here's the link to both the F and the X bushing. The F leaves it in stock form, the X allows you to set the angle of the rear shock. It both improves cornering and lowers the bike slightly.

http://www.synergyseals.com/shop/index.php?cPath=22

[firebolter]

In all reality, the 200 as it comes stock is set up pretty good. I could have easily rode mine without touching the stock jetting but of course, i did muck with it!

For now in the cold temps

07 200XC

178 Main

42 pilot

JD Red in clip 4

A/S 1 turn out

runs great. starts easy and runs clean. No spooging.

When the temps climb up past the 40's, I go down one click on the needle and 1 on the main.

Suspension, while it is stock, works great for me at 210 lbs. Seriously, the XC is a little stiff but I am very happy with it's manners in the trail. I have only adjusted the clickers a couple on the compression.

Other than the usual bolt on's like skid plates, bark busters etc....I just ride mine and it flat works. Since I have gotten mine, 2 of my buddies are now 200 fans and have sold their RFS' and are heading back to the 2T world.

[gmoss357]

In all reality, the 200 as it comes stock is set up pretty good. I could have easily rode mine without touching the stock jetting but of course, i did muck with it!

For now in the cold temps

07 200XC

178 Main

42 pilot

JD Red in clip 4

A/S 1 turn out

runs great. starts easy and runs clean. No spooging.

When the temps climb up past the 40's, I go down one click on the needle and 1 on the main.

Suspension, while it is stock, works great for me at 210 lbs. Seriously, the XC is a little stiff but I am very happy with it's manners in the trail. I have only adjusted the clickers a couple on the compression.

Other than the usual bolt on's like skid plates, bark busters etc....I just ride mine and it flat works. Since I have gotten mine, 2 of my buddies are now 200 fans and have sold their RFS' and are heading back to the 2T world.

Good info. Have you experimented with the Sudco needles? If so, how do they compare to the JD needles? I am suprised you are getting good performance out of the stock rear spring at your/our weight.

[firebolter]

Remember, the stock settings on the XC's are much stiffer than the EXC or XC-W's. My 525EXC is mushy compared to the XC. So for now, it is working well unless I am really hammering it out in the open. But in the woods, goes right where I point it. No deflection and great intended line tracking even over roots and such.

No, I didn't play with the Sudco's. I used the JD needles since I have had such good success on my other 2 bikes. If not careful, you can go "jetting crazy" and try crazy amounts of settings. No, once I get it where I like it, strong bottom-no plug loading/pulling mid and good top, I am happy and I get that with the JD red and the main between 172-178.

[gmoss357]

Remember, the stock settings on the XC's are much stiffer than the EXC or XC-W's. My 525EXC is mushy compared to the XC. So for now, it is working well unless I am really hammering it out in the open. But in the woods, goes right where I point it. No deflection and great intended line tracking even over roots and such.

No, I didn't play with the Sudco's. I used the JD needles since I have had such good success on my other 2 bikes. If not careful, you can go "jetting crazy" and try crazy amounts of settings. No, once I get it where I like it, strong bottom-no plug loading/pulling mid and good top, I am happy and I get that with the JD red and the main between 172-178.

I agree, but they are still sprung for lighter riders, no? I know the 07 susp made a big improvement in stock form toward eliminating the deflection problem.

On the jetting, I am the same way, just trying to get there, simply. I will definitely not be going jetting crazy. lol Just didn't want to spend the JD money. hehe

[Mike in Fresno]

remember that the 07 and newer have a different leverage ratio in the rear so springs are different from the 06 and earlier. The motors went to a 36mm carb as well so jetting is different too.

[Mike in Fresno]

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125/200 Power valve adjust:

This system is a screw adjustment, no springs like the 250-300.

On the right side of the motor on the clutch case area there is a large aluminum nut. Under this is the adjuster. Remove the large nut, loosen the 8mm head lock nut at the 4 oclock position. There is a large flat sided adjuster under the large alum nut, it should turn by hand. This is what you turn to adjust the power valve opening. It turns about 3 full turns. Do not turn the adjuster to hard once it bottoms out as the balls inside can become stuck if you bottom it hard. Dont loose the large copper sealing washer or the piece of rubber in the lock bolt hole at 4 oclock.

Many will just set it to the "Langston" setting and go. Find that on Transworld MX web site as well as another description of how to do this. Also found there is a part that wears in the system, called the control lever, and will make the bike run real bad like ignition or carb trouble. I chased this for one year before I found it was this part going bad.

The way I do the adjustment is by feel of the "hit". First warm the bike up completely by riding it for 5-10 min. Then remove the parts described above. Turn the adjuster one turn in any direction and then leave the nut cover off and ride the bike. You should be able to feel the difference from where it was set before you changed it if you just rode it for a few minutes like I suggested. As long as there is no water, mud, excessive dust it wont hurt anything to ride it for a minute with the cover off.

Now stop the bike and turn the adjuster one full turn back the other way from where it was originally. Now ride it again and you will have just ridden it with three different settings. This will give you a late opening, an early opening and somewhere in the middle.

Now that you have felt what the adjuster can do go back to whatever opening you liked the best and now adjust it in half turns to fine tune it to where you like it. Some like to just set it to the "Langston" setting and ride. Thats Ok, but I like it a little lower/earlier.

Now to clarify what you are trying to "feel". The hit is just as the bike comes on the pipe, spins the wheel, wheelies or some wording that you will understand. You dont have to ride the bike far to test this, only 100' or so in one gear and feel the hit. Maybe shift gears from 2-3 or 3-4 to feel the hit, not X country riding. Once you have it where you think it should be then put it all back together and then go for a ride to see if it is what you want.

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How to fix 125-200 counter shaft seal leaks:

May be same on other 2 strokes also

I just lay it on its side....I did a search on the parts and found that there is a new seal on the 05' that is thicker by .5 mm, #0760324571. Also there are thicker o-rings too, like #0770250020 ...Heres how I do it ,,first I clean the area well so grit doesnt get down inside the hole as you take it apart...take the sprocket off and then clean the splines of the shaft to get more dirt out...I grab the inner sleeve with my fingers and pull it out while twisting. Some might need pliers...the next thing I do is use a seal puller to get the old seal out. It can be done with a screwdeiver, but be careful not to scratch the case side walls when doing this and yes it is in there tight...then reach in with someting with a little hook on the end to get the old o-ring out, a bent paper clip works well...THERE IS ANOTHER FLAT SHIM IN THE BOTTOM. BE SURE IT IS IN THERE TOO...next I inspect the sleeve. If it has grooves deep enuf that you can feel then consider replacing it. If not replacing then use fine sand paper and buff the outside to get it smooth, not enuf to remove the grooves, but enuf to clean it of all tarnish...after this I use the sprocket, and turn it over to the flat side down, as the tool to drive the new seal back in, this way it stays pretty square. Last nite my chain guide got in the way and I used a large socket to finish it up. Just drive it in far enuf so it is flush with the case. It can be pushed in quite a bit further and this is a possibility if you bugger the case or if the sleeve has a groove and you want the seal lips to rub a different part of the sleeve...put the o-ring back in, sleeve in with the groove down and put the spocket on top... The sprocket is also critical in this beacuse it is what puts the load on the sleeve and o-ring to make them seal. If using an aftermarket sprocket it may be a few thousands thinner and then may not be tight enuf...lastly I found that my sprocket clip had grooves worn into one side of it from the countershaft splines. This too will leave a few thousandths of less pressure on the parts. I solved that for now by installing it with the grooves down and fresh metal up. I will have to replace it next time. In order to get the clip in the grooves I use a large socket that just fits over the shaft and give it a few good whacks against the sprocket. If that doesnt do it then use a large tipped, blunt tool to tap the clip around and down, working around the edge until it goes in. The tool must not cut or bend the clip while doing this...thats about it. Some say they try cleaning the seal first with a q-tip and others just replace the o-ring. Others use some various materials under the sprocket to shim a little extra pressure on the seal system and it works for some... You can do any or all of these in steps to save money, but it wont save much time if you have to do it over and over till you get the right combination that stops the leak................

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[Mike in Fresno]

Common hop ups or fixes for a 200......................

The 200 is a small motor, for most people, for off road work. They feel as if the motor is too pipey, busy or hits too hard. This is not helped by the wide ratio gear box of the EXC/XC-W. Some say 1-2 are too low so they gear up, but then there is a big gap to 3rd. Some go the other way to eliminate 1-2 and just ride the taller gears. I find that because of the smaller motor it is easier to ride with the close ratio gears of the MXC/XC. It helps the small motor to always be in the right gear and not bog when power is needed. This is my personal opinion. I find that it helps to evenly space out the gears on th XC/MXC by gearing it up in the rear to a 46 or 45t. This helps remove a little of the snap and makes the bike pull longer. 1st is still plenty low for me. I recently got a used EXC gear set and some day will split the cases to put in the EXC 6th gear to give me that top end, low RPM ride it lacks.

Things that are always asked are what motor parts do I get for it. I will try to list the most often quoted:

Jetting is the first thing anyone should do on a KTM. They come rich on the needle from the factory. This causes spooge, and is rich off idle that surges into a midrange hit. If you are agressive it will work. If you like to be smooth or go slow it wont work so well. For 05 and older the Sudco DDK needle is the all around use needle. It smooths the mid surge. I use a JD kit blue needle. The newer bikes have a smaller carb and the jetting is different. I dont want to give suggestions for what I havent experienced, I have an 02. With the change from a stock needle to a straight taper, or JD kit, you need to go up 2 sizes on the main or it wont run right and may seize. Generally around a 182-185 main. If you should happen to need parts for the carb look at a Kawasaki dealer as the carbs are the same and much cheaper.

The stock pipe is considered the best all around pipe. The KTM hardparts is a good replacement. The Gnarly is a low end pipe and does noticeably take away some top end over rev from the motor. It is thicker and stands up better to abuse from rocks n logs. I personally have a PCII on my bike and really like the way it helps smooth the bottom and gives me some top end pull, just a little different from the stock pipe.

The next is the power valve adjust. This is like a free tuning tool. Use it. It makes night n day differences in the way the motor makes its power.

Throttle cam... throttle cams have different cams that interchange with the grip body. It comes with 3 different rates. One is like stock, one is quicker and the last is slower than stock. With this you can change the motor feel. The slow one will make the bike much smoother and less hit will be felt. Having a hard time controlling the hit/wheel spin/wheelie time? About $100.

Reeds, I use V3. I have tried Boysen, but the V3 help wake up the motor. In this same area there is a reed block spacer on the 06. This can be added to the older bikes, but it makes getting the carb on n off harder and the air boot is real tuff to do. There are also aftermarket ones avail. This gives you more low end.

Motor mods...There are a few guys who know what they are doing with KTM 2st. KTMs come with a poor squish band in the motor and this can help lead to jetting issues with some motors, like the 300. I had my 200 head cut to clean this up and it also raises the compression a little to give more midrange power, mine uses pump gas and other more agressive cuts need race gas. Its real nice for my fat butt to have a little extra go when I need it. You can also have the full race stuff done too, like port, stuff the cases, etc.

Clutch.... The inner hub, springs and clutch plates from a 90's Honda 125 fit right in, cheaper than KTM. The stock clutch has aluminum and steel plates mixed together. The oil turns gray from the alum breaking down. I use steel to keep the oil clean, less clutch wear and less warping when they get hot from slipping up a nasty hill.

I recently got a Rekluse Pro auto clutch. It takes a couple of rides to get used to. You set the idle a little higher to keep it from stalling and this also helps keep it engaged for downhills. It has several different set-ups for the engagement point. The clutch lever works to disengage the motor, but doesnt slip the clutch, its kind of on or off. I use it to start the bike or when I stop to wait for riders to catch up, takes a little load off the bike and helps with the heat on the clutch. I am now really starting to like this clutch after a couple of rides with roots, rocks and ruts. I also took the bike to the deset for a multiple day ride. So far there isnt much negative about this tool. The only one I can think of is when the motor is off you cant have the bike in gear and use the clutch for a rear brake when trying to go up or down on a bad spot where the motor may have stalled on you. BUT it doesnt stall often so its almost a non issue. It makes ruff stuff easy, so if you ride the ruff stuff its like cheating. In the wide open, like the desert, it still works just fine. Your jetting has to be right or it will spooge even more than before due to riding a gear high to let the clutch slip and work like it should. I adjusted what I thot had been perfect for the last couple of years.

Along with the Rekluse I also got a spare rear wheel and put a trials tire on it. This is the next step in the ruff stuff. It also helps the rear feel smoother with less shock transmitted thru the rear on square edges, rocks n such. Amazing climbing ability.

I have recently purchased te X bushing from Synergy, but havent put it in yet. It works on any KTM linkless rear. You can run it stock heigth, .5" lower or 1.5" lower. Report soon.........

[gmoss357]

Thanks Mike for the information, I was going to go looking for some of that today. Do you mind posting your jetting specs. I think it would be good to have a database of jetting and other specs for this bike. It's always nice when getting a new bike to be able to find the info easily. Here is a post from a database I started for the YZF/WR 250. Copy and paste it if you like, don't if ya don't.

Year:

Model (E,W,XC,M, SX):

Main jet:

Pilot Jet:

Air screw (turns out):

Needle model/Clip position:

Altitude where you ride:

Temperature where you ride:

Other mods:

Degree of satisfaction:

[motonole]

Same here, ,I've made mine a litle faster. FMF pipe/arrestoer, V force, 2 teeth up in the rear, re-valved suspension for the south GA woods, stock everything else except for EE barkbusters and graphics. Lots of cleaning and tightening.

[KTM2smoker]

my bars busted on the track. they clean snapped in half. i replaced them with pro taper CR-HIs. the suspension has been giving me problems though. i need to change the fork oil.

[FlyArmy]

This 200 club is a great idea. I think the KTM 200 is the best kept secret in the off-road world and the more information we can share the better oour machines will be. Anyway, I had a 2006 200XC-W and it was by far the best dirt bike I have owned in 35 years. I kept the jetting stock, adjusted the powervalve to the Langston setting, put a 46 tooth sprocket on the rear, installed Enduro Engineering light and put hand guards on it. The little two-hun would go anywhere I wanted it to and I could torque it around all day. It was easy to start and never let me down. I sold it before this deployment to Iraq, the worst mistake I ever made. I plan to buy a new 2008 or left over 2007 200 XC-W when I get back to the USA in June. Are there still any left over 2007's out there and what kind of prices are they asking? I don't need the latest and greatest anymore. I just trail ride with friends and besides none of us can afford to get hurt. I hope we get a lot more contributions to this 200 club in the future. Mike

[gmoss357]

Guys, I appreciate the input. However, I would like this thread to be more of a database, with personal technical information provided. If you post generic information, it's not really going to be helpful to readers in the future. Please copy and paste the jetting data and input you information. If you change it, then post it and your results. Add anything else that may be helpful.

Thanks.

[firebolter]

Are there still any left over 2007's out there and what kind of prices are they asking?

A friend of mine has been searching for a 08. They are almost gone, but I have seen a new leftover 07 XC on ebay from a shop in the NW that had a Buy it now price of 4999.00

There are some 07's starting to show up for sale used now. I am very happy with my 07. No desires for a 08. Hopefully you'll be able to find one, but they are getting scarce, leftover 07's I mean!

[FlyArmy]

I believe there is another thread in KTM 2-strokes that deals specifically with jetting the 200EXC/XC/XC-W? Correct jetting is a small part of the overall bike and input on setting up the overall bike correctly is very important. Buy the JD kit and you will be happy from sea level to to ten thousand feet. No fussing, no guessing, no headaches, no spooge, it rips!! JD also has a jetting table/data base already worked up that makes jetting simple:thumbsup:

If you want to leave out the generic stuff, I will go along with it.

[old man dan]

Ok this seems to be a great idea so here's what I've got so far. 06 200xc bought new in mid 07, I have about 50 to 60 hours on it.

IRC Tubeless Trials rear tire (with a tube of course) @ 8 psi-fantastic in the rocky rooted terrain here, haven't even really noticed any serious "squirminess" that some have complained about. I would seriously suggest this to anyone who is thinking about trying one out as long as you don't have long stretches of higher speed connecting trails or gravel roads.

SDG tall soft seat. The original seat is nasty, this one lets me ride alot longer although it's a little tall for shorter riders.

44 front springs, 8.0 rear spring. I'm 195 without gear and this gives me 40 mm static and 120mm rider sag with 5mm of preload. Seems pretty good so far but I may try an 8.4 in the summer when things dry out and get rougher.

I have an FMF Gnarly pipe ( I crushed the original). So far so good but I may try something else to get more of an across the board power improvement. This has great bottom end but it doesn't rev out great. So far the only jetting I have done is lowering the needle a clip and setting the air screw. I'm at sea level to 1400 ft and it's ok but I'm sure some experimentation can improve things. I would welcome suggestions for jetting, I have a JD kit in my wr450 so I may go that route. I also have the usual skid plate, rad guards, handguards etc. I love the gearing on this bike but if I rode in an area where I had to ride faster speeds for longer distances I might consider the xc-w. As it is, I usually have a choice of two gears for any situation.