Battery alternative

[Red Dog]

Have any of you tried the E-Batt? The idea sounds good but I've not heard anything from anyone who's used one. Your input is appreciated.

[Red Dog]

None of you know anything about these? I would have thought that something that drops pounds off your bike would be known by those of you who ride e-start bikes.

[Shake]

I am curious too, especially about the lithium ion battery weighing 3/4 lb. But I've never heard of them til today. Anyone got one?

http://ebattonline.com/

[Quino]

well whats the price comparesment because 3Lbs isnt much to loose unless you are racing professionaly and trying to shave weght every where you can. you can loose more weght in a week just buy going on a diet. umm as far as the lithium ion is concernd i dont know if they are any beter, i have a makita cordless gun with lithium bats "yes i know its like comparing apples and oranges" but 2 batterys lasted about 9 months. could have also just been luck of the draw

[Shake]

As far as Lithium Ion goes, it's the only type of battery that will run my GPS for more than a few hours. They are FAR superior to any other battery, at least as far as AA goes.

As far as the cheaper e-batt, they are right in line with the pricing of the stock battery for my CRF450X

And for the same price, I would love to drop 3 or more pounds at the top of my bike, where it matters the most when changing direction. I might not notice 3 lbs, but for the same price? Of course, that is assuming you need to buy a new battery anyhow. I would not scrap a perfectly good standerd battery for these.

[Soul Man]

I agree with Shake. 3lbs from seat-height means more than an overall 3 lbs.

You could argue that every bit counts: lose 3 lbs of battery, a pound of Ti springs, footpegs etc. etc. how much weight do Ti shock springs save? Not sure, but my buddy's YZ125 has them stock and it is the lightest 125 on the market (not that there are many 2 strokes left...). the main drawback of e-start is the weight, and most of that is the battery.

I've always been tempted to get one, but don't like the fact that it won't charge off the stator. If they had it set up to recharge from the stator I would definitely get one.

Yuasa batt for a WR250F is 4.6 lbs (http://www.yuasabatteries.com/vehicle_search.asp)

the lithium ebatt is 12 oz (0.75 lbs). That's closer to 4 lbs difference (3.85 lbs) for virtually same cca (130 Yuasa 120 ebatt). And that nearly 4 lbs is all up at the top of the bike.

I've thought about getting an e-batt to use locally, but keep my stock battery for longer trips rides such as when I spend a week in Moab.

[Chas_M]

The main problem with these batteries is that they must be charged up with an external charger as they are not compatible with the bike charging system, i.e. they only run on a 'total loss' therefore you are out of luck when the battery runs down out in the middle of a long trail ride.

[The Spanky]

The main problem with these batteries is that they must be charged up with an external charger as they are not compatible with the bike charging system, i.e. they only run on a 'total loss' therefore you are out of luck when the battery runs down out in the middle of a long trail ride.

Lithium Ion batteries also have a dangerous tendency to overheat under the right set of circumstances. Not sure I'd want one under my ass...

[The Spanky]

I am curious, though, as I don't know much about these particular batteries. If it is capable of powering the bike's electrical system, then it's compatible with that system, so why can't it be charged by the bike's charging system?

And the web site says this:

No. Ni cad batteries require a different charging method than lead acid batteries.

But then it says this:

You will need to wire the bike so that the regulator will charge the battery as you use it.

So which is it? Can the battery be charged by the bike or not?

[Red Dog]

They have two types. The Ni-cad which does charge off the bikes charging system. It weighs a bit more (but still less than half that of a battery) and costs $89.00. And a Lithium battery setup which weighs in at 12oz. It is supposed to be good for up 140 starts per charge and comes with a charger for $129.00. For that much weight loss it sounds like a sweet deal. I mean after all, how many times do you start your bike when you go riding? For the dual sport guys who are running full lights, turn indicators etc., it might not be enough. That's why I inquired initially. I was hoping to get the straight scoop from someone who's actually got one in use.

When you think about the weight savings per dollar it still sounds good. Look at the cost of a Ti silencer versus aluminum.

[PumkinFest]

NEVER by a battery that doesnt self charge, it may sound ok, but i had that experience when i installed an electric start on my old 450. It was a complete pain charging it every time you use it and theres nothing worse than it going flat after a stall on the side of a hill, which happened to me a few times. That 140 starts sounds bull to me, and id bet it would only account for 2-3 turns of the starter, so not counting cold starting, flood starting or older bikes that take a little longer to start.

[Rip Wheeler]

Have any of you tried the E-Batt? The idea sounds good but I've not heard anything from anyone who's used one. Your input is appreciated.

You mean a different type of battery or eliminating the battery all together and using kick start? You will need a battery eliminator. Basically a large capacitor to absorb voltage spikes in the DC charging system. A large capacitor would do it. I know they make a device. Havent seen one in years.

[Red Dog]

While your opinions are interesting, I was asking if anyone had experience with the E-Batt. If you have please reply, if not perhaps another thread should be started regarding experiences with other types of things. Thanks.

[The Spanky]

They have two types. The Ni-cad which does charge off the bikes charging system.

And the web site says this:

Quote:

No. Ni cad batteries require a different charging method than lead acid batteries. They say the Nicad does not charge from the bike's system in one section, and then they say it does in another section:

But then it says this:

Quote:

You will need to wire the bike so that the regulator will charge the battery as you use it.

Seems to be a bit confusing to me.

I'll keep my kickstarter...

[mini_S_man]

I think you'll find the second part where they say "yes" is to a dual sport setup.

I'm still unsure if the dual sport system will or wont overcharge the battery and shorten its life

BTW has anyone installed one yet? I'm keen to know if the nicad is worth while on my DS bike

[jjesneck]

My battery alternative is my leg, sorry couldn't help myself.

[The Spanky]

I think you'll find the second part where they say "yes" is to a dual sport setup.

Not trying to be a smart-ass, but what difference does that make? Charging a battery is charging a battery, I don't care if the bike is street legal or not.

[Ud_Luz]

While your opinions are interesting, I was asking if anyone had experience with the E-Batt. If you have please reply, if not perhaps another thread should be started regarding experiences with other types of things. Thanks.

This isn't anything you couldn't run down to your local Radio Shack and construct. A cursory examination of Ni-Cad or Li-Ion batteries will tell you exactly how this works. What I take issue with is the outlandish statements these guys make.

1) Does the motorcycle charge the battery?

No. It easily last between oil changes.

Maybe if you change your oil a couple of times a day.

2) How many starts will I get?

Expect to get at least 100 starts out of one charge on a 450cc. bike. The 250 guys will get more,

around 200 or more. Lithium users will get even more.

This means that you can start your bike 10 times an hour for 10 hours before needing a recharge.

A good time to charge the battery is during oil changes. It is easy to add charging to your regular maintence.

This would be funny if it wasn't such an outright lie. 100 starts, extraordinarily unlikely. 200, you've got to be kidding. ?

# 3.0 AH NI-CAD 100 CRANKING AMPS 2.2 LBS.

# 2.4 AH NI-CAD 100 CRANKING AMPS 1.7 LBS.

# 2.4 AH LITHIUM ION 120 CRANKING AMPS 12 OZ.

Lets compare this to the Yuasa YTZ7S, a common battery. The specs on this battery are 130 cold cranking amps. Note the EBATT site doesn't reference CCA. Now, have you EVER heard of a YTZ7S having the ability to start a bike 100 times without recharging, much less 200 times? These people are on a different planet than the rest of us.

I would love to see a discharge rate chart comparing their units to this common bike battery. Their assertions won't bear up.

Not trying to be a smart-ass, but what difference does that make? Charging a battery is charging a battery, I don't care if the bike is street legal or not.

Different battery types require different charging rates. The old style lead acid batteries will endure high charge rates and are relatively impervious to spikes and memory effects. Unlike lead acid, Ni-Cad and Li-Ion batteries don't do well with repeated short charge/discharge cycles. Where these batteries perform very well is with a full and complete charge before a discharge cycle. This is one of the reasons they recommend an external charger, especially with the Li-Ion battery pack.

Just about the only application I can see for this is where light weight is of critical importance and there would be few instances of having to start the bike like on an e-start motocrosser.

[mini_S_man]

Great input Ud_Luz.

So in your opinion do you think they have strapped together about 13-14v worth of aa nicad/Li-ion batteriesand selling it for 300% profit and making outlandish claims?

If we disreguard the charging perculiarities. I thought the beauty of LI-ion batteries was beacuse they ran at full voltage until the last moment like a mobile phone battery.

back on the charging topic. If i was to put a nicad setup in a dual sprot how bad do you think memory effect would damage the battery? I'd imagine that after about 5-10 rides it would only hold its charge for about an hour after the bike is shut down. Wouldn't you?

[The Spanky]

Different battery types require different charging rates. The old style lead acid batteries will endure high charge rates and are relatively impervious to spikes and memory effects. Unlike lead acid, Ni-Cad and Li-Ion batteries don't do well with repeated short charge/discharge cycles. Where these batteries perform very well is with a full and complete charge before a discharge cycle. This is one of the reasons they recommend an external charger, especially with the Li-Ion battery pack.

I know all of this. My point was simply to illustrate their contradictory statements, where they state in one part of the article that the battery can not be charged by the bike's charging system, and in the very next section they state that it can, as long as the bike is being used for dual-sport. Like I said, the battery neither knows nor cares what the useage of the bike is, it only knows if it is being charged or not. So either the bike can charge the battery, or it can't, but they say both yes and no.