Mapping boxes for EFI?

[Todd D]

Ok I've read all the comments about the RMZ falling flat on top. This is something you can fix with an aftermarket pipe and a tuner box.

My question is can you alter the mapping for low end, mid and top? Like if it's lean on bottom and rich on top can you adjust each rpm area. Will this be a trial and error or will the aftermarket companies give you a baseline to start with.

I've always liked Suzuki's and I may buy an RMZ later this summer once the hype and prices cool down.

Looks like the 09 KXF's will also be EFI.

Thanks!

Todd

[Wayward Son]

it will need a tuning device to be able to fix them.

a pipe will help some with the high rpm wot richness.but there are other issues that need to be addressed.

[Todd D]

Well back to my original question.

Will the aftermarket companies give you a guideline to go by just like they would with jetting? Will you be able to adjust the rich/lean mixture at various rpms? For instance if the bike is lean on bottom and rich on top can I adjust each individual area? If not it would be easy for someone to make the bike run worse instead of better.

Now that everyone will have to buy a tuner box (unless your buddy has one)for mods I wonder if the manufacturers will come down on the price of their exhausts?

Opinions???

Todd

[souphmars]

has anybody actually got one of these boxes and made any changes? if so what was your results? what mods have you put on your bike?

[Wayward Son]

Well back to my original question.

Will the aftermarket companies give you a guideline to go by just like they would with jetting? Will you be able to adjust the rich/lean mixture at various rpms? For instance if the bike is lean on bottom and rich on top can I adjust each individual area? If not it would be easy for someone to make the bike run worse instead of better.

Now that everyone will have to buy a tuner box (unless your buddy has one)for mods I wonder if the manufacturers will come down on the price of their exhausts?

Opinions???

Todd

depends on the device.

but in general you will be able to adjust any throttle position vs rpm area.

just like jetting you will be able to make it worse as well as better.

in order to do any real tuning you will need a wideband a/f meter.

[Todd D]

depends on the device.

but in general you will be able to adjust any throttle position vs rpm area.

just like jetting you will be able to make it worse as well as better.

in order to do any real tuning you will need a wideband a/f meter.

Ok it's getting too technical.

What is a wideband a/f meter?

[Wayward Son]

google dynojet wideband commander and innovative lm-1

[Ronin 26]

in order to do any real tuning you will need a wideband a/f meter.

Or an EGA (exhaust gas analizer)

[Wayward Son]

Or an EGA (exhaust gas analizer)

and a dyno to use a EGA.

the wideband can be used while actually riding the bike.

[Ronin 26]

The dyno is the best way to tune with both, as you know. I'm not dissing the WB O2 sensor but on a MX bike it's pretty hard to tune seat of the pants with the WB.

We would need a bung in our pipe to accept the sensor. We would need a tach (if we were using a power commander or something similar) and we would need a whole bunch of space to get our WOT runs at all rpm's, not to mention the part throttle stuff.

I've used the WB on street bikes to tune while riding, but i have never tried it on an MX bike, i think it would be pretty tough. Have you tried it?

I was just offering another suggestion on a tuning device, I think we can both agree that the dyno is going to produce the best map possible in the least amount of time with out having to concentrate on what we might hit. ?

[Wayward Son]

with out a doubt the dyno is the way to go.

but yes,i have used a dynojet wideband commander to tune on the track.works great.you data log rpm,tps and the fuel.

i do this for fuel injection anf carbs.

you can tell exactly whats going on.

i am no way suggesting to try and look at a gauge while riding.thats just asking for a major accident.

data log only.

i send my rider out for a session.when he come sin i downlaod the file.look at.make and changes and send him back outto confirm the changes.

its usually done.

this is only when im tuning at a track thats not local.otherwise,i do all tuning at the shop on the dyno.i rarely make changes at the local track.

[Ronin 26]

data log only.

That makes sense for sure. Watching the tach could get ugly like you said.

Are welding fittings in for the WB or using something else?

This could be a great way to fine tune a dyno tuned finished map. I usually test ride them to confirm everything is good. It’s the part throttle stuff that seems to get finicky sometimes, but usually after the EGA/Dyno tune they’re darn close to spot on.

[Cold Blooded]

I don't know a whole lot about these but I am interested in getting one for my 08 450 but can't find one that would work on the bike. I could just be missing something but I am not sure that it would hook up to my bike. I want to get one because i live a fair ways away from any decent dealers and its much more convenient for me to do tunning myself. Would the WB actually work on the bike? if so what would i need to do? if not is their a similar product that would work?

[Wayward Son]

most wideband come with a weld in bung,but if you have a ti pipe a specialty bung will need to be sourced.

[Ronin 26]

I don't know a whole lot about these but I am interested in getting one for my 08 450 but can't find one that would work on the bike. I could just be missing something but I am not sure that it would hook up to my bike. I want to get one because i live a fair ways away from any decent dealers and its much more convenient for me to do tunning myself. Would the WB actually work on the bike? if so what would i need to do? if not is their a similar product that would work?

Like Eddie said riding and tuning with the WB is difficult without data logging.

I have a dyno at my shop in Sylvan Lake and could tune it for you, or you can pick up the power commander (you'll need one either way) and try it seat of the pants, but it's difficult with the PC3 as you tune each throttle position at each rpm.

[huffster]

Two Brothers and FMF both make a box for this bike...Dobeck boxes.

[SamZagan]

Like Eddie said riding and tuning with the WB is difficult without data logging.

I have a dyno at my shop in Sylvan Lake and could tune it for you, or you can pick up the power commander (you'll need one either way) and try it seat of the pants, but it's difficult with the PC3 as you tune each throttle position at each rpm.

What is the cost of you tuning it? Do you have a way of adjusting the map without a PC or mod box?

Thanks,

[sts475]

Hi there!

I like this discussion! I'm hoping that someone will develop software for a laptop and that the cpu has the ability to be flashed or someone developing a replacement flash type module for it. I don't like the Power Commander setup where they take the original injector pulse width and alter it. There isn't any feedback in the stock system which would be the ideal situation. For off road riding, it would have to be mapped from sea level to at least 10,000 feet. I don't think that the map sensor (unless the baro value reset (if stored)) will accommodate this wide a variable. Running in open loop with only rpm and map will be limited in the adjustability of the system to it's environment. It will be interesting to see how all of this works out. It's just like the 1980's all over again with speed density driveability problems. I'm pumped about the dirt bike engine management age! It's about time!

Good Luck!

STS.

[Ronin 26]

What is the cost of you tuning it? Do you have a way of adjusting the map without a PC or mod box?

Thanks,

No you need a fuel controller. I have a Teka that tunes Suzuki's by burning the new settings into the ECU. When i get an 08 RMZ i'll see if it works on the off road stuff as well.

[sts475]

No you need a fuel controller. I have a Teka that tunes Suzuki's by burning the new settings into the ECU. When i get an 08 RMZ i'll see if it works on the off road stuff as well.

What is a Teka and where does one find out about it?

Thanks!

STS.