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We argued DB = what about the rest of the issues


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Well the sound thing has been beat to death, I have just finished reading A date with a paper plate by Del Albright in Blue Coalition mag this month.

He makes one statement that really hit me and I quote

Leaving Trash only contributes to the campaign by the anti-access folks.

That made sense to me. How many times have you gone out riding to find bottles cans, and other debris strewn around in outback areas. Bigger question how many of us pick it up after bitching about how stupid they people are for leaving it.

Granted it may not be there from a bike rider, could be from hikers and such. But I am just as guilty for not packing it out.

My point is we as riders, hikers, equestrians, fisher(people) and so on are fighting many ridicules reasons with the anti-access crowd (I like that Word anti-access). We can not afford to leave any argument un challenged as well as nipping it at the bud. It doesn't matter if it is sound or trash or breaking down fences or drunken fist fights at glamis. We are all responsible for keeping our sport alive.

The anti-access crowd is centered on one thing and that is no access for everyone but a selected few. I see it simply as I see it with arguing with a child, DON'T, take the argument away. With a child it is simple don't respond with threat, act, respond with a decisive reason, think about what it is you are arguing, in essence a time out.

With these groups its as simple don't argue, be decisive, react to remove there argument out of the picture. Pic up trash, repair broken fences, work with neighboring land owners, Lessen the sound on your bike.

As an example when we had the West Coast TT ride last Sept, the Camp Site we choose had a very negative few on Bikers in General. This is from the owners having nothing but problems with PUNKS, who have no respect for anyone or anything. They took advantage of the camps hospitality and rules. The rules were simple 5mp, no wheelies and no bikes started between 8 am and 7 pm Simple.

When Cisco, Fryboy, Blue One and I started to speak to the owners of the camp site, we campaign for 2 -3 months to allow for the back gates to be opened for the riders.

With reservations they did, at the end of the weekend they congratulated TT members for being so nice polite and helpful. We Had TT members all over the camp site mainly in one-location. But because we showed the real side of the Dirt Bike world, there minds were changed. They no longer bundle us with the freaks of nature that ride. They appreciated that we left the camp sites cleaner then when we came. they appreciated the fact that we walked our bikes to the gate, walked our bikes to the trucks.

They welcomed us back for our second annual ride in May 2003. It is winning the crowd and the hearts, that will turn this around, its image. Every camp site makes a diff...

Sorry for the rampage

Go ahead and flame CO guys..

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Go ahead and flame CO guys

Why flame, your finally figuring things out!!! There is more to the "getting areas closed" issue than noise. This has been a major point of my argument. So even though you won't answer the questions in my post, like I did for you, I see I'm getting you on board against the real enemy of our sport!!! Congrats.

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No it hasn't

why should I answer a question that was already answered and not understood.

Besides our whole debate was based on one issue sound. I made it very clear about that. I also made it clear that my opinion on the sound issue with 80% of us is a penis thing, More Sound Grunt Grunt Grunt The assumption by many is it is our right to have a 107db bike, It is not our right to have laud bikes it is not our right to anything but what was originally in our Constitution, Inalienable Rights period. Nothing in there address the issue of laud bikes.

The argument for laud bikes on both sides to me is ignorant and non factual.

This is a perfect example of the bickering between two of the same. A point of view is by nature only seen for the viewer. We must (US THE DIRT BIKE WORLD) see it in a global context PERIOD.

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EGO you never answered it, you can use what ever excuse you like for not wanting to answer it but the fact remains you didn't. If you would like me to repeat it I will. Now that your on board moving in the right direction, I don't care if you answer it at all. My point all along has been to get us all on board, to see the true enemy of our sport, and move in a united front. You have made big strides in that direction today. Thank you.

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Typical Cop never wrong ๐Ÿ™‚

I guess we can say neither one of us is going to back down,

so with that I will say we both missed each others points.

why is that?

Becouse we are so entrenched in our own opinion...we fail to see the global picture.

and that is one of the major dangers to us as riders trying to unite in a common goal.

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I am very entrenched in my own opinion, that is why I'm willing to answer questions that are posed to my about it. Ask me anything about it and I will respond with a through, non flame answer. Can you do the same??? If you say yes I will ask a few questions again. Your choice. We can have a intelligent debate about this, or we can go along on the path that you chose saying to "flame away" or feebly attempts at insulting me as a cop.

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i agree with ego that we complain about trash, etc. but do nothing about it.it's amazing to me that the GREENS will complain till they are blue in the face about trash and other harmful things we (OHV enthusiasts)do to the environment. what gets me is i sometimes work in what one would call the "inner city". the "inner city" is just LOADED with trash! you don't see the greens knocking on peoples doors to tell them they need to pick up the garbage, junk cars and all manner of trash that resides in their yards! this goes to show that this is just outright discrimination towards our sport. they have an agenda and don't care who they step on to achieve it. i would bet that many of these GREENS drive large gas guzzling SUVs on the way to their meetings or rallies or whatever these freaks call them. apparently, it's ok to talk out of both sides of their mouths. i am an AMA member and i am SOON going to join the BLUE RIB COALITION and i urge everyone here to do the same. the greens are going to take all of OUR land, bit by little bit. sorry so long, need to vent.

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That was not a stab

it was a funny

you are lready started this into an argument just as you have with all the other posts.

Im done...Ya call me a troll

Figured you would be soon as an offer came to debate it on a mature level. You started the trolling with the last statement in your first post about trolling away.

EGO the issue needs to be debated in a non confrontational manner by our side. I'm willing to do that. The issue is to important to our sport.

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It was Flame Away

I will say this one last Time Reading = comprehension

Now this is a stab

Typicle Cop

I expected no less from you EGO, lol. I've been insulted better by crack whores and 14 year old street dealers.

Now let me know when your ready to get on the issues to help our sport instead of trying to make yourself look clever on this forum.

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What debate, all you have done is target me as a troll refute everything I say and twist words to try and make yourself look intelligent on one thing only "noise".

pissed yea I am getting agitated by your constant harassment. I say typical cop with a smile and your shorts are on so tight you take it as a poke.

I would say you need to get off the streets, my buddie the SJ cop is suffering the same ills you are. he has the same mentality as you do Crack Whores and all. And looks at everyone as a potential target bad guy.

Its good he has me to talk to, I see his frustration with the dregs of society, I bet you suffer the same thing. Maybe your issue is you have no one to talk to to vent but other suffering cops

am I poking at you yet I sure hope so.

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Boy EGO I can tell I'm getting to ya, lol. You say comprehension and then say your making you last comment then come back with another post. ๐Ÿ™‚

Your cop insults don't bother me, I find them funny attempts by an agitated man that knows very little about me but is trying to insult me because I have made him angry.

You having a "buddie" that is a cop in SJ that is stressed makes you an expert at figuring I'm stressed in my job, haaaaa, try again. FWIW tell your buddy to come here to Colorado to work, lots of Cali cops have and they love it, gets them out of that "crack whore" mentality.

Now with that all said, take a breath, deciede if you want to keep cop bashing, if so there are many fine websites and news groups for that, or take a step back and lets get on with the issues that are important to our sport.

Heres a topic, Noise, do you think that 96 DB will save our riding areas??

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Enduro..

the only thing that will save our riding areas is money... we need to buy off the politicians, just like everyone else does to get a law they want passed... corruption is everywhere... maybe the bike manufacturers should contribute to political campaigns... ๐Ÿ™‚

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Enduro..

i personally would LOVE to have a bike that was absolutely silent (with no loss of power of course, actually, just saw an electric dirt bike in the Jan. issue of Dirt Rider) but i really don't think 96db will do.. Take the gun issue here in Cali or in England for example.... In england, they started with saying you could only own a gun if you followed certain rules... within a few years, ALL guns, even AIR guns in England are illegal..(oh, and the U.N. released a study revealing that you are 6 times more likely to be a victim of a violent crime in London than in New York) California seems to be trying to follow suit...

so, if it isn't sound, it is tearing up our land.. if it isn't that, it is pollution (isn't that one of the main reasons why the yzf was developed anyway?) this will NEVER end unfortunately, so giving in gets us peace for a while, until they come up with their NEXT demand....

that is how it is.. and as for cops being stressed, hell... i bet you all the money i DON'T have that being unemployed is MORE stressful... ๐Ÿ™‚

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This is my whole question you refuse to answer, If you answer it I will answer all of your mundane none essentials.

You are stuck on this one thing Noise = and your sole argument has been 96db. my question was and has been to you is

Why is the 96db / Noise issue so wrong?

you only argue its my right, I like noise, its not the real issue. I have only agreed with one point, you make its not the real under lying issue, its just many I agree. You have taken me to task on everyting I state. You have failed to offer a reasonable answer to the very simple question

Why is the 96db / Noise issue so wrong?

You answer this one question and I will answer all yours as you list them

As I have stated I believ that this noise loud bike is a penis thing for 80% of us, Tim Allen Grunt Grunt Grunt.

My hole contention on the noise issue has been that most people dont understand it, and feel its their right to have a laud bike, It dosnt matter if its a harley rider or a dirt biker. there is this mentailty / Penis Thing that is the real controversy, for are differant points of few in the bike world

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