Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  

Rotella oil??

Recommended Posts

I usually stay out of oil threads as they seem to go nowhere, but I will say that I have used Rotella 5w-40 from 2001-2007. In that time I put tens of thousands of very hard miles on my bikes and never experience any oil related problems, no abnormal wear, no bottom end, clucth or tranny problems etc.

Since 07, I switched to Belray exs because I've been able to get it at a good price locally. Have I seen any difference in engine life like ring wear etc. No. Is it a better oil than Rotella, yeah probably. I'm sure I could probably extend my oil change intervals with the good stuff although I will keep to my self imposed schedule.

For most, I think Rotella is fine. That is just my opinion based on my years of use. If you run a 250f bumping the rev limiter on the track all the time, I do believe I would use a high end oil. Trail riders, big bores and those who are not revving the snot out of their bikes all the time should be fine with Rotella. I you change oil frequently, again Rotella is fine and offers good protection. If you're one who doesn't keep up with maintanance and doesn't change oil often, maybe you should put the high dollar oil in. Again, just my opinion.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I usually stay out of oil threads as they seem to go nowhere, but I will say that I have used Rotella 5w-40 from 2001-2007. In that time I put tens of thousands of very hard miles on my bikes and never experience any oil related problems, no abnormal wear, no bottom end, clucth or tranny problems etc.

Since 07, I switched to Belray exs because I've been able to get it at a good price locally. Have I seen any difference in engine life like ring wear etc. No. Is it a better oil than Rotella, yeah probably. I'm sure I could probably extend my oil change intervals with the good stuff although I will keep to my self imposed schedule.

For most, I think Rotella is fine. That is just my opinion based on my years of use. If you run a 250f bumping the rev limiter on the track all the time, I do believe I would use a high end oil. Trail riders, big bores and those who are not revving the snot out of their bikes all the time should be fine with Rotella. I you change oil frequently, again Rotella is fine and offers good protection. If you're one who doesn't keep up with maintanance and doesn't change oil often, maybe you should put the high dollar oil in. Again, just my opinion.

👍 perfect

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
This is like all the claims I keep hearing about Amsoil. Every time I read a review or comparison of Amsoil, it is always published by Amsoil. And guess what? Their data always says their oil is better than anyone else's. It must be true, it says so right in their lab reports. I have yet to locate an independent study or report which validates their claims, and I've taken a passing interest in the topic for the past few years.

Can't vouch for their claims of superior wear numbers, but one thing I noticed is that they generally compare their products against conventional oils, and occasionally group-III "synthetics" such as Rotella 5w40.

Amsoil buys their base stocks from Mobil, then blends their own additive packages.

I CAN vouch for their shear stability. I've tested a number of oils in my Vulcan, and Amsoil MCV and Mobil-1 V-Twin have both remained in-grade for a 50wt for 2,000 miles, and at 6,000 miles had just cracked into the heavy 40wt range.

Motul Twin-Synd, Castrol GTX, Mobil-1 15w50, and Royal Purple.... all of those sheared down to 30wt in 2,000 miles.

My Vulcan carries 3.5 quarts, and has a wet clutch and common engine/tranny oiling system.

http://personal.linkline.com/rlockyer/oil/oil.xls

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I just got my RC4 250 engine back from Bill Maico and he installed a 320cc kit. He recommended me to use Rotella 5w-40 "Synthetic. Either the oil is not too bad or Bill Maico himself doesn't know what he's talking about. I will have to say the oil is not too bad, but thats me!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

i have ........red cap gold cap and now grey cap.......great stuff i use it in the engine of my crf450r3.......i run cenpeco in my crf450r7 and rotella gold goodness in both bikes rekluse equipped clutches.....rotella forever........rekluse forever........crf450r forever!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I just got my RC4 250 engine back from Bill Maico and he installed a 320cc kit. He recommended me to use Rotella 5w-40 "Synthetic. Either the oil is not too bad or Bill Maico himself doesn't know what he's talking about. I will have to say the oil is not too bad, but thats me!

he know's what is up.......rotella t is pure golden goodness:thumbsup:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I see a few members leaning towards the idea that an offroad motorcycle never sees engine oil temps much over 200f. This is as far from the facts.

Any offroad motorcycle is capable of engine oil temps well above 300f.

On our test track we commonly see 250/450f oil temps well above 300f in less than 6 laps.

I am saying that in 5- 1 min 20 second laps at pro level we see temps going from ambient (approx. 85f) to above 340f. When we see an egnine temps causing an oil temp at the 340f range this is usually 120 degrees hotter than the coolant temp.

Has anyone ever seen these kind of temps on an on the road diesel? Have I ever seen turbo oil temps this high?? Yes!

I have just personally seen multiple GM LS3 engines making between 850hp and 1200hp depening on the set up. The oil was getting so hot that when exiting the turbo (watercooled also) the air entrainment was backing up into the turbo and causing failure. At the beginning the way this was dealt with was a #10 AN line for the turbo oil outlet. Now its taken care of by lowering temps and resolving the air entrainment issue.

The thing is that many offroad motorcycles see these temps daily.

A simple google will tell you that many of the barrier additives used in motor oils start depleting at 200f. This deplation rate increases as temps rise and moisture is present. ZDDP once considered the base additive for engine oils starts to degrade at 200f. This is why RotellaT gets so black in such a short time in a motorcycle.

I am not one who believes that we all have to run an approved motorcycle oil. But there are much better oils available than the cheap diesel oils. Does this mean that Rotella T will cause failure in seconds? I think not. Is there better oils available, yes. Does the price difference make the more expensive oil a better choice?? This you should decide.

Allways keep in mind one doesnt have to be a pro to see excessive engine temps. 1st/2nd gear tight technical muddy stuff most anoyone will have engine temps exceeding 300f.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Rotella now contains much less ZDDP that it did in past years. I prefer to use motorcycle Synthetic racing oils such as Maxima or other top brands. Anything less is just asking for trouble in the long run.

IMO,

Dwight

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As another motorcycle oil expert pointed out , Rotella doesn't in itself cause problems as it doesn't contain the additives that cause clutch slippage. But it also doesn't contain the anti stress additives that prevent wear and problems under stress that KTM high RPM engines can produce.

Use what you want but the bottom line is that Rotella is very minimal as a racing oil. If you rebuild on a regular basis then it may work for you. Other wise use a good JASO MA rated Motorcycle racing oil.

IMO,

Dwight

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Delo 400 15/40 does not have added friction modifiers,it has moly in the package. The myth moly makes a clutch slip is just that a myth. Mobil MX4T has moly,Redline has moly,Maxima has moly,Motul etc. I have started using Delo 400 since my 2 stroke days ,8 years ago,in the tranny side. I have been using it since I been on 4 strokes,THERE IS NO CLUTCH SLIPPAGE. Delo has 200 ppm of moly which is nothing,Redline has 800 ppm of moly I hear no complaints with redline. Yon cannot go wrong with Delo, Delvac, or Rotella,the new formulas have dropped the phos and zinc levels,but not enough to worry. Delo went from 1350 ppm zinc to 1200 and about the same with phos. This is a very slight drop ,NOTHING,Rotella amd Delvac did the same,exhaust filtering is the reason for SEMIS,not to get into big details. There is still plent of Zinc and phos,they are not the only antiwear additves that go into a oil.I choose Delo out of the the other HDEO because of the moly,I just like there package better. I would in a heartbeat use Delvac or Rotella. They all have awesome HTHS#s High flashpoint#s and good antiwear additives. 80% of motorcycle specific oils on the market today that go for 6.00-9.00 qrt are just marketing ploys,there numbers in a UOA SHOW TO BE A JOKE COMPARED TO HDEO. Not all M/C oils are just high priced and no GUSTO,,but you would be suprised after a UOA to find out that a 8.00 qrt oil didn't prove too well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

what are you paying for Delo 400? where do you buy it? Is it a group II/III base "synthetic" like rotella? I just bought a gallon of Rotella yesturday at wally world and it has gone up to 20 bux a gallon.

DBM

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Delo 400 15/40 does not have added friction modifiers,it has moly in the package. The myth moly makes a clutch slip is just that a myth. Mobil MX4T has moly,Redline has moly,Maxima has moly,Motul etc. I have started using Delo 400 since my 2 strokes days ,8 years ago,in the tranny side. I have been using it since I been on 4 strokes,THERE IS NO CLUTCH SLIPPAGE. Delo has 200 ppm of moly which is nothing,Redline has 800 ppm of moly I hear no complaints with redline. Yon cannot go wrong with Delo, Delvac, or Rotella,the new formulas have dropped the phos and zinc levels,but not enough to worry. Delo went from 1350 ppm zinc to 1200 and about the same with phos. This is a very slight drop ,NOTHING,Rotella amd Delvac did the same,exhaust filtering is the reason for SEMIS,not to get into big details. There is still plent of Zinc and phos,they are not the only antiwear additves that go into a oil.I choose Delo out of the the other HDEO because of the moly,I just like there package better. I would in a heartbeat use Delvac or Rotella. They all have awesome HTHS#s High flashpoint#s and good antiwear additives. 80% of motorcycle specific oils on the market today that go for 6.00-9.00 qrt are just marketing ploys,there numbers in a UOA SHOW TO BE A JOKE COMPARED TO HDEO. Not all M/C oils are just high priced and no GUSTO,,but you would be suprised after a UOA to find out that a 8.00 qrt oil didn't prove too well.

When oil companies went from using Mos2 to MoDtc the issues with clutch slippage went away to some extent. I have seent ratios of 1000ppm of Modtc not hurt a clutch in the beginning. At first we thought that the clutch slippage issue were resolved when companies went to the oil soluable Moly/ MoDtc.

Some of my posts years back I stated that I thought MoDtc was fine for wet clutches. But, the vast number of bike owners reporting clutch slippage using Delo made us go back and take a long term look at MoDtc.

Long term testing showed us that there is an issue with even MoDtc. Its the repediaive use of oils conatining a high concentration of Modtc. Modtc which is to some extent heatreactive actually decomposes when subjected to wet clutch temps in offroad bikes. We have (and others ) seen wet clutch temps exceeding 600f for short durations.

The plating action of moly builds up on metal parts as everyone knows. We believe this decomposition of moly at high temps builds up in clutch fibers, as well as metal parts.This is why some bike owners report clutch slippage using Delo. Never in the beginning but after a few oil changes.

Also Modtc decomposes even more rapidly when heat and large amoutns of Amine are present. Since amine is used in the making of oil this also constitutes a problem.

I also believe some riders being more agressive and putting more hours on their bikes is why they have a problem with oils containing moly over someone who rides a few hours a month that may not.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There have been many reports of clutch slippage with the changes in DELO the past year. There are also different types of Moly. Sure small amounts of Moly of the right sort will not give problems but it has to be the right sort. The makers of DELO are not concerned whether it works in a wet clutch enviroment in a motorcycle. There have been some issues with Synthetic Rotella also.

Dwight

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
what are you paying for Delo 400? where do you buy it? Is it a group II/III base "synthetic" like rotella? I just bought a gallon of Rotella yesturday at wally world and it has gone up to 20 bux a gallon.

DBM

No it is a Group I and Group II oil as is Rotella. Rotella "Synthetic" is a Group II/Group III base. Neither is actual SYNTHETIC oil.

Dwight 👍

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
When oil companies went from using Mos2 to MoDtc the issues with clutch slippage went away to some extent. I have seent ratios of 1000ppm of Modtc not hurt a clutch in the beginning. At first we thought that the clutch slippage issue were resolved when companies went to the oil soluable Moly/ MoDtc.

Some of my posts years back I stated that I thought MoDtc was fine for wet clutches. But, the vast number of bike owners reporting clutch slippage using Delo made us go back and take a long term look at MoDtc.

Long term testing showed us that there is an issue with even MoDtc. Its the repediaive use of oils conatining a high concentration of Modtc. Modtc which is to some extent heatreactive actually decomposes when subjected to wet clutch temps in offroad bikes. We have (and others ) seen wet clutch temps exceeding 600f for short durations.

The plating action of moly builds up on metal parts as everyone knows. We believe this decomposition of moly at high temps builds up in clutch fibers, as well as metal parts.This is why some bike owners report clutch slippage using Delo. Never in the beginning but after a few oil changes.

Also Modtc decomposes even more rapidly when heat and large amoutns of Amine are present. Since amine is used in the making of oil this also constitutes a problem.

I also believe some riders being more agressive and putting more hours on their bikes is why they have a problem with oils containing moly over someone who rides a few hours a month that may not.

I am reporting no clutch slippage using Delo 400 with a YZ250F,RMZ450, AND 2 YZ450F's COUNTLESS HRS,B rider a lot of sand.Better take all the other oils off the shelf with Moly also,MX4T,REDLINE,MOTUL, MAXIMA ,they all are M/C oils that contain moly. To each there own,typical oil debate,how you can single out one oil containing Moly,but M/C oils that contain moly are okay. I do however believe a certain oil may work with one specific clutch,but not in another.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
what are you paying for Delo 400? where do you buy it? Is it a group II/III base "synthetic" like rotella? I just bought a gallon of Rotella yesturday at wally world and it has gone up to 20 bux a gallon.

DBM

9.97 a gallon at WW and about 11.80 at Autozone,or Advance it is not a synthetic it is petroleum based.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I am reporting no clutch slippage using Delo 400 with a YZ250F,RMZ450, AND 2 YZ450F's COUNTLESS HRS,B rider a lot of sand.Better take all the other oils off the shelf with Moly also,MX4T,REDLINE,MOTUL, MAXIMA ,they all are M/C oils that contain moly. To each there own,typical oil debate,how you can single out one oil containing Moly,but M/C oils that contain moly are okay. I do however believe a certain oil may work with one specific clutch,but not in another.

If one does a search he will find many people reporting clutch slippage using delo. This is also why Rekluse quit reccomending it.

In no way was I attempting to single out Delo. We tested Delo because many bike owners, especially Rekluse owners were using it. Our original testing with Motdc was by adding it to engine oils. I have large and small amounts of every add pack ingredient in house.

Also if you read what I wrote I mentionioned other ingredients that cause Modtc to degrade rapidly. I think there are a number of reasons why oils containing moly effect one bikes clutch and not another. Some add pack ingredients effect other ingredients in adverse ways.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Dwight,

I find it odd that you have been whining about people flaming you on KTM talk and perhaps Thumpertalk. Perhaps, If you offered some "real world" practical advice rather than putting people down and talking about how "such and such oil" is only "type ll" or "type lll ester" or synthetic blah, blah, blah.

Why not try educating people rather than mocking them with "umpteen" question marks preceded by a cocky "LOL HA, HA, IN YOUR FACE" dumb-ass comment? Students, like all human beings, just get pissed off when you mock them.

Here's an example of one of your statements:

LOL, 300 to 500 Miles ??????????????????????

Most change Rotella about every 100 miles or less. Do you realize that 500 dirt miles is about 20 hrs or more use ? WAY, past safe oil change intervals

I'm so sick and tired of looking at your teacher hat signature at the end of each post - man, talk about cocky!

You can't even spell "o-r-i-f-i-c-e" (orifice) correctly Mr. Teacher. It wasn't just a 'typo' either 'cause I saw it on a number of occasions. Sorry for the low blow, but I find your preaching to be condescending and sarcastic.

People just want advice based on personal experience, not marketing hype.

If you're a teacher, start teaching and stop preaching about stuff that most people can't relate to. How about some advice rather that statements full of you fancy jargon. On the other hand, if you're not a teacher, lose the university professor hat; it's really annoying.

I'm obviously frustrated after reading many of your posts. Sorry, if I offend you, but seriously....

END OF RANT!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I usually do not get involved too often in oil threads when it involves 4 strokes, but this thread Dwight really brings out good info. And yes he does get tore up on KTM Talk regularly. I don't agree with some of his statements on diesels, they put oil through the ringer as far as soot and dirt. Any more the norm for class 8 trucks is 500+HP and these engines are often loaded at above 70% of the time at full output. Trucks in Michigan can be plated up to 160000 lbs and usually will get oil changes at 20000 to 30000 miles, so we have the need for 48 quarts of oil. It is not uncommon to find engines at 1200HP in the oilfields. Any way all my bikes see a steady diet of Rotella 15-40 and 5-40 BUT if I was going to subject my bikes to full race conditions in high heat I would switch to Maxima or Motul just for the added protection and life. And this is JMHO and what I do as far as oil. In fact I just changed my oil on my 300 and did not have enough Rotella so I topped it off with Motorex, Do you think they will like each other, or will I have a major meltdown:smirk: :worthy:🤣 CJ

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I know KTM recommends 15-50, but I have been using Mobil 1 0-40W on the engine side. I have been using Rotella in the tranny. Has anyone else used this weight of oil? The reason I ask is I get it for free. So I can change it as much as I want. Also is you change the oil often, how often should you change the filter? I know rule of thumb is change the filter every oil change but is it really necessary?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Reply with:

Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...