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well some guy hit me on my 400s brand new just had it for two weeks. the police report said it was the other guys fault and i took it in the shop to get fix through my insurance. we had all the parts in and the total was $4800 and they needed a $11 part and the insurance company totals the bike has this happened to anyone else. is there a way i can get my bike back ? im only 17 and this is all new to me :)

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Someone may correct me if I'm wrong, but you should get the option to buy the bike back from the insurance company. You will get the money for what they value it at. Then would be able to buy it back and pay for the repairs yourself....

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Yes that is a possiblity.

But with $4811 of parts needed you might as well just buy a brand new bike.

Over here in the UK, some insurance companies (like the one i work for) do a replacement bike service, where we will buy you a new bike. might be worth making enquiries about this kind of service.

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Oh man that really sucks. Personally with that much damage I would want a new bike

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thanx guys they wont let me buy it back noting and i still have $1500 on the loan so i have to pay that without me having my bike

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I'd rather have a new bike than one with $4811 in repairs done.

How much are they trying to say the bike is worth? Fight them to the death if you have to, if they're trying to lowball you with a unrealistic replacement value. They are an insurance company and their customer hit you, which makes them liable to compensate you fully for the damages their customer caused. They can't jack up your rates on you since they're not your insurance company so you should have no fear of reprisal, and often they would rather settle than go to court if you give them reason to think that could be in their future. It's literally their job to screw you, so it's in your best interest to make their job as difficult as possible.

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Yep, stand fast and demand fair replacement value, the other party was covered comprehensively I assume. You may need some representation in this matter, which would really suck.

Insurance companies, they are the same world wide.

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My car was totalled by another driver the other driver was 100% at fault

the insco offered me a low $ figure of 3k, I told them no I need the replacement value of 5k, I backed up my assertion with 10 classified ads from CL and the local want ads plus the KBB retail value to show that the replacement value was more than they offered.

They did not meet my original quote but we agreed on a number halfway between my offer and their offer 4k

I then bought the car from them for $100 (i kept the vehicle in my possesion the whole time) they didnt ask if I wanted to buy it back I had to ask them

I was able to repair the damage for 1k (parts only no paint)

I drove the car for two more years and then sold it for 1.5k fully disclosing to the buyer that it had been totaled...incidentally the buyer wrecked it 1 week later

in my case the airbags drove the cost of the repair so high the insco had to total the car, in reality I replaced the airbags (ebay $200) the hood, bumper grill fender and some other shizzle with a donor car from cl

I would guess based on suzuki new parts prices the totaled bike could be repaired for a lot less....

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I have progressive insurance, they told me that if my bike is a total loss that I dont have the option of buying the bike back. I was told that due to the influx of online auctions and people parting out there bikes that they were no longer offering a "buy back". However I was told at the same time that they have specific vendor auctions that they will sell the totaled bike through and that a portion of the auction price is credited back to help keep your premium down...

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If you have only had the bike for 2 weeks, a fair settlement would be for them to pay the finance off, and give you whatever deposit you had paid + plates etc.

You should be no worse off, it was not your fault.

Neil. :):D:worthy:

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If you have only had the bike for 2 weeks, a fair settlement would be for them to pay the finance off, and give you whatever deposit you had paid + plates etc.

You should be no worse off, it was not your fault.

Neil. :):D:worthy:

I agree with this.

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One thing the insurance co. won't tell you about is depreciation compensation. Even if they pay to fix your ride, you can still get them to pay for how much you will lose selling it as a wrecked ride versus a never been wrecked ride. They have a term for this that I can't remember right now, but you will have to push them to get it.

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Do not settle. It's like fighting a speeding ticket. The insurance companies are out for there own good. It's a business after all. Be polite but take a stand. If they realize you are not going to give up try climbing the ladder on them. The old can I speak to your boss. They will take you seriously after a while. If that doesn't work get the representation one of the other guys suggest.

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I used to work for an insurance company. When I read threads like this and comments like Messerschmitdt's (its their job to screw you), I have to smile at the blissful ignorance of some...

First, what is the ACV (actual cash value) of your bike, as it is, at the time of loss? That is determined by the condition, accessories, mileage, and market demand of the bike for its FMV (fair market value). This is the key figure. Not what you paid for it, not what you think it should be, or what your friend told you it should be, but what the market says it should be. Why is this important? Example: I like a DRZ400 so much, and I'm such a sucker to the salesperson's pitch, that I buy it for MSRP, and add taxes, freight, advertising fees, shop donut fees, and the finance manager's boat payment to my "out the door price", and that equals $6500 (lets say). Does that mean that this is what the bike is worth? What about the next example: clever shopper gets the dealership to bid the MSRP down, doesn't pay for donut fees and fluff, takes advantage of a sales promotion, and gets the same bike out the door for $5800. Which is the correct ACV? Is it the responsibility of the insurance company to pay for the faults and/or issues the buyer had getting the bike? Nope. The only thing that levels the playing field here is to determine its ACV (used interchangeably with FMV, which is defined in the language of your insurance policy, which is a legal contract, which I'm sure everyone reads). And the ACV is what the market will buy it for, which has noting to do with what you bought it for, or how much you finance it for. Last example: if the insurance company should pay "what I got it for", then if I get the bike from my "uncle" for $100 bucks in exchange for helping him paint his house over the summer, then should I get only $100 bucks?

Normally, ACV or FMV is determined by doing a market survey (call dealers for quotes, check newspapers ads, review CycleTrader, etc). But for most companies they simply use NADA (National Auto Dealers Association). It allows you to select the motorcycle in question and determine its wholesale value and fair market value. This represents the low and high value of the bike for its condition and demand, respectively. My experience is that an insurance company will take these two values, then the average of the two, and voila!... there is your ACV. Remember that policy you have? And the little booklet that outlines the language of the contract of your policy? It will state (while not specifically) that this method is fine for calculating your ACV. What it also states is that your best friend's brother's step dad, who works for Mega Cycle Sales in New Guinea, will not suffice for pinpointing the ACV of your bike. So since it is apprently the job of the insurance company to "screw you" it really is only you who may "screw yourself" for being ignorant of your insurance policy. The policy is a legal contract with definitions and specific exclusions and benefits, a contract that is always being tested in courts and the legal system, and to my knowledge, still exists and is the basis of the American insurance industry, in the form it lives and breathes today, which is not there for handouts. If you have a loss, and it is COVERED, then the policy will pay "WHAT IT CLAIMS IT WILL PAY", nothing more, per the way the policy "SAYS IT WILL BE PAID". Don't like it? Get another policy, or bond yourself, or save the money to pay yourself back in the event of a loss. Sounds cold and insensitive, and it is. Its business, not holding hands.

I digress. I do not mean to insinuate you did not know this, but insurance really is "caveat imperor" (buyer beware).

Once your ACV is determined, take roughly 30% off this value, and that is your total loss threshold. If any damage to your bike, regardless of how it got damaged (tipped over cosmetics, smushed under a garbage truck, stolen and recovered stripped, etc) exceeds this threshold, your bike will be deemed a total loss. At that point, no repairs will be considered. Example: $5000 bike, total loss threshold would be $3500. That 30% deduction is called the salvage value, or in other words... if the bike was sold at a salvage yard at auction, one could expect to pay $1500 to buy that totaled bike. This salvage deduction is decided as either a matter of policy (it is always 30%, or 25%, or whatever, for all losses) or by confirmed sales history of bikes like yours at auction. Harelys typically command up to 50% salvage, as the market is crazy for parted out Harleys (and the OEM VIN that can be transferred to a rebuilt bike).

It is not uncommon for an estimate of repair to come in at one figure, and then subsequent repairs cause the bike to total. In the above example, a $5000 bike has $2500 in damages. Fix it! But then during teardown the frame is shown to be tweaked and the cost of the frame, plus labor, plus repair shop fluff, plus whatever else can come up for additional repairs, takes the repairs over $3500. Then total it! Even if the repairs were $3501, just a dollar over, the bike is toast.

Options? "Buy the bike back". This is also called "owner retained salvage". This means you keep the bike, and the insurance company deducts the residual salvageable value of the bike OFF of the ACV, and you get the difference. This will not pay to fix it, because the above math has just shown it would cost more than this to repair it. But it would allow you to keep it. Maybe use the majority of the money to fix it, keep some damaged bits on it, and maybe even take some of the money to buy a TV, or a new Playstation. The insurance company doesn't care. If you owner retain a total loss bike, the bike is removed from the policy, is non-insurable from that point on (insurance company's do not insure write-offs as that would be considered "double dipping"), and any grief or joy in trying to fix it is your problem. You may be able to insure it with liability coverage later, but not for physical damage (comprehensive and collision).

Or settle it as a total loss. Insurance company pays the ACV, plus taxes and fees for original title fees, less your deductible, and the claim is done. The bike goes to auction where Joe Blow, or anyone, can buy it. You could even buy it there yourself later, but you would be at the mercy of the buying public that day (if you even have an auction license to get in on an insurance company total loss auction). You'll note that settling this way does not guarantee you will get what you paid for it. If you are upside down on your note, you will now need to negotiate that with your lender. 'Cause guess what?... there is a finance contract for them lending you money to get the bike and that contract has no sympathies, only legally binding language that stipulates your obligations for paying them back.

Owner retained salvage losses have been falling out of favor lately because the pontential salvage value of the bike (while it can be estimated roughly) is far more subjective that determining an ACV. You can determine an ACV by using published pricing guides, tracking sale prices in newspapers, etc. Tracking salvage values is much less specific, and can truthfully be determined only at an auction. To try and debate this value with an owner is fruitless and often contrary to settling a claim quickly and efficiently. Because at the end of the day, the insurance company only needs to settle you claim per what the policy states, and that will always be "the lesser of" option that the policy allows. But you knew that, because you bought the policy and it ultimately was your responsibility to know "what you are buying".

One exception may be when the loss of the bike is within a few weeks of its purchase. Then it can be reasonably assumed that the replacement value of your bike is pretty much the same thing as its purchase price. If you bought it for a fair price, and another NEW bike can be had for the same value, then the insurance company may simply offer you enough money (from settlement) to go get another one. This is not common, but is possible. But the more people fight, then the more the loss will need to be documented and adjusted properly (in case the ever-present threat of, "I'll sue you!" comes about), and any latitude in values is gone. Then you can surely expect to hear discussions about "it losses 20% just by driving it off the lot!", and "its a used bike now, even if it has 5 miles on it... would you pay full price for it?", and so on.

Without knowing the numbers involved in your loss, your best bet is to try to document on your own why your bike is worth more that what the insurance company is offering. Get ads, print out values from other pricing guides, and get that ACV up as high as you can get it. If the values are legitimate, then you're entitled to that value. Then take the settlement money and refinance your replacement bike by carrying over any balance owed from the first bike, and then see if your insurance agent or dealership may offer any "gap" insurance (another layer of insurance) so that if you suffer another total loss, your primary policy pays the ACV, and your "gap insurance" pays the difference up to the payoff on your note. Gap insurance doesn't care about the ACV, salvage value, etc,... it is insurance aimed specifically at picking up where your primary policy leaves off and paying up to the full value of your note. The rates for this insurance are therefore determined by how upside down you are, and the potential for making a claim before you catch up on your payments to satisfy your payoff amount and are no longer upside down.

Good luck.

And please feel free to flame on, everyone. I'm sure I didn't get this right :)

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If you have only had the bike for 2 weeks, a fair settlement would be for them to pay the finance off, and give you whatever deposit you had paid + plates etc.

You should be no worse off, it was not your fault.

Neil. :):D:worthy:

In my idiotic country, things aren't that simple. If you finance a vehicle, the insurance company will not pay you the outstanding finance amount, only market value. Say I buy it for $5000 but I owe $6000 due to interest, service fees etc they will only pay out $5000, the other $1000 is your problem....unless you pay extra insurance cover each month for them to cover these cases as well.

Anyway, in the OP's case it is very lucrative for the insurance company to total the vehicle. They pay you whatever they owe you, claim the same amount back from the driver who's fault it was (or from his insurance comp) and then still sell the totaled vehicle. Win-win all the way for them.....bastards...

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In my idiotic country, things aren't that simple. If you finance a vehicle, the insurance company will not pay you the outstanding finance amount, only market value. Say I buy it for $5000 but I owe $6000 due to interest, service fees etc they will only pay out $5000, the other $1000 is your problem....unless you pay extra insurance cover each month for them to cover these cases as well.

Its the same over in the UK :)

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how do you establish market value on a 2 week old vehicle? Nobody sells 2 week old vehicles so there is no data on which to base the value.

I have heard of people getting their cars totalled when that new, and ended up getting enough money to actually replace the car with another brand new one.

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I suspect they subtract 2 weeks worth of depreciation from the new price to get a pretty accurate figure.:)

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In my idiotic country, things aren't that simple. If you finance a vehicle, the insurance company will not pay you the outstanding finance amount, only market value. Say I buy it for $5000 but I owe $6000 due to interest, service fees etc they will only pay out $5000, the other $1000 is your problem....unless you pay extra insurance cover each month for them to cover these cases as well.

Anyway, in the OP's case it is very lucrative for the insurance company to total the vehicle. They pay you whatever they owe you, claim the same amount back from the driver who's fault it was (or from his insurance comp) and then still sell the totaled vehicle. Win-win all the way for them.....bastards...

It's the same here also. 99% of the time you get hosed, no matter the circumstance. And to lose less you have to fight your ass off. Its a messed up system.

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Okay, here's the deal with insurance: Insurance is "The transfer of risk in exchange for consideration". You transferred the risk that you would have a loss (crash damage, stolen, injury, etc) to a company who was willing to accept the risk that they might have to pay for one of those things. You transferred the risk by giving them "consideration"...aka paying them the money that they calculated the risk to be worth. So you have a legal contract with the insurance company, and by law they now must pay. I think we all understand this so far...read on.

There are two parts to every insurance company. The first part is "You're in good hands" - this is when they want your money. All sorts of friendly agents, nice brochures, commercials touting how great they are, etc. Then there is the other side of every insurance company - the claims side that is responsible for paying out money. This is who you are now dealing with - and they can be tough to deal with, but not impossible. The key is to be realistic and understand who and what you are dealing with. If insurance companies just handed out a blank check to pay every little thing and pay every single loss to the full amount that people think they are owed, none of us would be able to afford insurance. A couple of posters mentioned that the insurance companies won't cover financed amounts - of course they won't (sorry guys). Say that you and I buy the exact same bike on the exact same day, and ride it right next to each other every time we ride even a single mile. You owe $6000 and I've paid extra payments so I only owe $4500. Say a semi truck takes us both out, and both bikes are totalled...should the insurance company have to pay more because you didn't pay extra payments? They are covering what the bike is worth, not what you owe (again, sorry guys).

Remember this word - INDEMNIFY...it means "to make you whole again". You have had a loss, and since you held up your end of the contract (that's why your policy is in force), the insurance company now MUST indemnify you - in other words, they have to make you whole. In your case with a 2-week old bike, I think that the only reasonable way to accomplish this is for them to buy you a new bike, plain and simple.

Sorry for the long post...I'll wrap it up with this last bit - someone backed into my minivan in a parking lot and the person in insurance claims was jerking me around. I said "Insurance is the transfer of risk in exchange for consideration. I've upheld my part of the contract, and now I've experienced a covered loss. At this point, your part of our contract is to indemnify me - so stop jerking me around or I'll hire a lawyer and we'll see you in court with our contract (the policy) in hand and you'll lose, plus get bad press, plus pay my attorney and damages. How about you just do us both a favor and pay the claim so we don't have to bother with that". It was game over for him, the claim was immediately paid in full. Hope this info helps...sorry about your bike too!!

Eric

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