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Some JD Red vs Blue needle testing done....

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Hey guys,

I went out to the desert today and did some JD needled testing (05 YZ250) here is wat I found out.

-alt 2k

-72 degrees/sunny

-trail riding with some open sand washes mixed in

-each loop is about 30 minutes in duration

-stock pipe with FMF TC2 s/a

-using Motul 800 premix

-91 Chevron pump

-172/45

------

1st loop:Jd red needle #2 clip, a/s at 1 1/2 from seated no spooge , but plug was too lean. Bike was a bit too zappy to 1/4 throttle..way to easy to get the frnt wheel up, boardline scary.

2nd loop:Jd blue needle #2 clip, a/s 2 1/4 out from seated got a drip of spooge (just like a tear drop size on the lower portion of end cap). I did not care for the blue needle as the power was lazy to 1/4 throttle, now too hard to loft frnt wheel over trail junk. Plug did look a bit more mocha color..still some may consider it lean.

3rd loop: Jd red needle #3 clip, a/s 2 out from seated, Light mist of oil residue around end cap, appeared like it would develop a drip if ran longer. Bike ran like a dream, perfect power now all the way to WOT. Power to 1/4 now 100% usable and not scary. This is the set up I will stick with. I have decided to live with a little spooge if the bike runs so good and fits MY riding style. Plug is pretty light tan color.

Also, I forgot my premix when I left the house. So I stopped in on the way and picked up the Motul 800 only because thet delaership did not carry Amsoil. The Motul burned every bit as clean as anything else I have used and smelled good. It could have been the favorable weather but the bike seemed like it ran smoother with the Motul.

shrub73

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i bet if u got the motul 710 premix instead you would have had no spooge at all!!

Got lots of it when running a TC2, 32:1, and Motul 600 injector oil. Went to OEM silencer and it doesn't spooge much if at all. In the summer using Silkolene and a leaner PJ I only get a light mist of oil residue around end cap. :)

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i bet if u got the motul 710 premix instead you would have had no spooge at all!!

How do you figure that.....?

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I contacted James yesterday about the Jet Kit I received for my 98 YZ250.

Here is the conversation, modified to read more clearly.

Me: I got your Jet Kit for my 1998 YZ250 and I have a question.

I will be starting the bike this coming weekend for the first time after a frame off restoration and I want to run my bike at 32:1 ratio.

I am aware that a bike running at a pre-mix ratio of 50:1 will be jetted differently than a bike running a pre-mix ratio of 26:1 for the same location/temps/elevation. I am in Memphis, TN with Elevation of 0-1500ft, temps will be 75°-85° with humidity of 40%-60%

I would like to know which jets from your kit to use in order to set the jetting up for a 32:1 ratio

His Response:

The jetting in the kit is based on an estimated mix ratio near 40:1 and temperatures near 65F. The 32:1 is close and your temperatures are warmer, which partly offsets the oil ratio, so you might benefit from a step richer needle clip position during break-in. The differences are small, and riding terrain and speeds can affect the choices too.

Try the following jetting-

  • pilot jet from kit
  • AirScrew 1 1/4 turns out
  • Blue marked needle in the middle clip position (#3 from top)
  • #172 main jet

Keep the idle speed set low for a more consistent idle mixture.

Just putting this info out there so people can see the differences in jetting based on things like elevation, temps, Pre-Mix Ratio, etc.

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My 06 is running really crisp with the stock needle (N3EJ). I really can find no fault in the way the bike runs now. I have Roland's .045 squish head and jetting adjusted to temperature. No pinging, no spooge, and the bike runs well.

I'd like to try a JD needle just to see the difference but I can't see forking out the $$$ just to see a minimal gain or no gain.

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Hey guys,

I went out to the desert today and did some JD needled testing (05 YZ250) here is wat I found out.

-alt 2k

-72 degrees/sunny

-trail riding with some open sand washes mixed in

-each loop is about 30 minutes in duration

-stock pipe with FMF TC2 s/a

-using Motul 800 premix

-91 Chevron pump

-172/45

------

1st loop:Jd red needle #2 clip, a/s at 1 1/2 from seated no spooge , but plug was too lean. Bike was a bit too zappy to 1/4 throttle..way to easy to get the frnt wheel up, boardline scary.

2nd loop:Jd blue needle #2 clip, a/s 2 1/4 out from seated got a drip of spooge (just like a tear drop size on the lower portion of end cap). I did not care for the blue needle as the power was lazy to 1/4 throttle, now too hard to loft frnt wheel over trail junk. Plug did look a bit more mocha color..still some may consider it lean.

3rd loop: Jd red needle #3 clip, a/s 2 out from seated, Light mist of oil residue around end cap, appeared like it would develop a drip if ran longer. Bike ran like a dream, perfect power now all the way to WOT. Power to 1/4 now 100% usable and not scary. This is the set up I will stick with. I have decided to live with a little spooge if the bike runs so good and fits MY riding style. Plug is pretty light tan color.

Also, I forgot my premix when I left the house. So I stopped in on the way and picked up the Motul 800 only because thet delaership did not carry Amsoil. The Motul burned every bit as clean as anything else I have used and smelled good. It could have been the favorable weather but the bike seemed like it ran smoother with the Motul.

shrub73

Have you thought about trying to find a shim to put under the red needle in the 2nd clip position to try the in between, like cj wai in the other discussion talks about, or trying the 48 pilot again with the red needle 2nd clip and seeing if that helps

Just a thought

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I contacted James yesterday about the Jet Kit I received for my 98 YZ250.

Here is the conversation, modified to read more clearly.

Me: I got your Jet Kit for my 1998 YZ250 and I have a question.

I will be starting the bike this coming weekend for the first time after a frame off restoration and I want to run my bike at 32:1 ratio.

I am aware that a bike running at a pre-mix ratio of 50:1 will be jetted differently than a bike running a pre-mix ratio of 26:1 for the same location/temps/elevation. I am in Memphis, TN with Elevation of 0-1500ft, temps will be 75°-85° with humidity of 40%-60%

I would like to know which jets from your kit to use in order to set the jetting up for a 32:1 ratio

His Response:

The jetting in the kit is based on an estimated mix ratio near 40:1 and temperatures near 65F. The 32:1 is close and your temperatures are warmer, which partly offsets the oil ratio, so you might benefit from a step richer needle clip position during break-in. The differences are small, and riding terrain and speeds can affect the choices too.

Try the following jetting-

  • pilot jet from kit
  • AirScrew 1 1/4 turns out
  • Blue marked needle in the middle clip position (#3 from top)
  • #172 main jet

Keep the idle speed set low for a more consistent idle mixture.

Just putting this info out there so people can see the differences in jetting based on things like elevation, temps, Pre-Mix Ratio, etc.

JD also sends a chart with the kit. Really easy and nice to deal with.

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Have you thought about trying to find a shim to put under the red needle in the 2nd clip position to try the in between, like cj wai in the other discussion talks about, or trying the 48 pilot again with the red needle 2nd clip and seeing if that helps

Just a thought

I have thought about it and it was going to be my next move had I not found a desirable setting this last time out. I am pretty excited about my third loop report with said jetting. I guess it comes down to that I really want to start pounding out some miles rather than wrenching on my trips. It takes me 2 hrs just to get to the closest riding spot, so my jetting is good enough for this season.

What jetting have you decided on? oil? ratio? riding style?

shrub73

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My 06 is running really crisp with the stock needle (N3EJ). I really can find no fault in the way the bike runs now. I have Roland's .045 squish head and jetting adjusted to temperature. No pinging, no spooge, and the bike runs well.

I'd like to try a JD needle just to see the difference but I can't see forking out the $$$ just to see a minimal gain or no gain.

I felt the same way with my 06. I almost sold the 98 with the jd kit in it because the 06 ran so well without it.

Just for fun I decided to try his kit. When I say "kit" I really mean "Needle" as the mains and pilots are the same as the bike came with in the spares "baggie". I felt like his needle woke up the midrange. It eliminated a lean/rich feeling my bike had just a sit came off the pilot jet. I admit it is sort of expensive, but I think its worth the money.

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I have thought about it and it was going to be my next move had I not found a desirable setting this last time out. I am pretty excited about my third loop report with said jetting. I guess it comes down to that I really want to start pounding out some miles rather than wrenching on my trips. It takes me 2 hrs just to get to the closest riding spot, so my jetting is good enough for this season.

What jetting have you decided on? oil? ratio? riding style? shrub73

I can never seem to settle, last weekend i ran with the 45 pilot red needle 3rd clip and a 172 main and i'll probably leave it the same for for this coming weekend, when the temps warm somemore i'm definitely going to try the blue needle 2nd clip since for me the blue needle seems to pull off the bottom stronger. Amsoil Interceptor 32:1 burns very nice, for the MI singletrack around here with lots of small throttle openings

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To me the biggest value of the JD needle (red) has been the nice smooth throttle response to 1/4 throttle vs N3EJ. Also, the kit provded a good starting point for my jetting. I say well worth the $$.

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I can never seem to settle, last weekend i ran with the 45 pilot red needle 3rd clip and a 172 main and i'll probably leave it the same for for this coming weekend, when the temps warm somemore i'm definitely going to try the blue needle 2nd clip since for me the blue needle seems to pull off the bottom stronger. Amsoil Interceptor 32:1 burns very nice, for the MI singletrack around here with lots of small throttle openings

Hey same jetting I am at now. So you are enjoying the Interceptor huh? I did try the Interceptor and to me the bike did not idle as smooth or run as run as clean as with the Motul 800. Maybe I just needed to tweak the a/s a bit. I know a lot of folks like the Interceptor though. After reading the reported high flash point of Motul 800 I am very suprised I was not in spooge city, as most of the riding is single track. Go figure.

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Hey same jetting I am at now. So you are enjoying the Interceptor huh? I did try the Interceptor and to me the bike did not idle as smooth or run as run as clean as with the Motul 800. Maybe I just needed to tweak the a/s a bit. I know a lot of folks like the Interceptor though. After reading the reported high flash point of Motul 800 I am very suprised I was not in spooge city, as most of the riding is single track. Go figure.

Definitely no issues with how it runs or idles, the differences in weather between me and you is probably the deciding factor as well as your at a slightly higher elevation then me, i'm around 800'

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Hey same jetting I am at now. So you are enjoying the Interceptor huh? I did try the Interceptor and to me the bike did not idle as smooth or run as run as clean as with the Motul 800. Maybe I just needed to tweak the a/s a bit. I know a lot of folks like the Interceptor though. After reading the reported high flash point of Motul 800 I am very suprised I was not in spooge city, as most of the riding is single track. Go figure.

Llamaface who rides a 07 KX250 runs Interceptor at 40:1. He's riding Idaho single track from 2,500 to 7,500 elevation and higher. He loves it. As soon as my assorted brands run out, it's on my list to buy! :)

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