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Flipping a trials tire?

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I'm swapping out my Dunlop trials tire for a Maxxis Desert IT (D100) and plan to put it back on after the race weekend.

Does anyone here have any experience in flipping a trials tire to get extended life? I wasn't sure if it would cause the tread blocks to tear or otherwise ruin the tire.

Thanks for the insights.

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I don't know if I've flipped mine or not, but i don't think there's much point in it. Unlike a knobby, which uses sharp knob edges to grip, a trials tire grips more with the rubber surface. I almost think they work better after getting worn in a little.

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Some of the trial tires are directional. I realized that after I mounted my IRC backwards ... DUH !!! . It still went about 1500 miles before it started to spit the knobs, Probably would have gone twice that if I had mounted it the right way.

Wait till you go back to knobbies... There is an adjustment period you'll go thru. It will feel like you have a flat for a while..

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I run Michelin trials tire and my riding buddy and I have both flipped a directional tire with no problems.

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Flipping a trials tire is unecassary. They grip as the soft tire wraps itself around an object the little knobs pinch the surface they are traveling over. I would think that if you already have run a trials tire in one direction and created the cracks around the knob from that direction, flipping it would create cracks from the other direction thus shortening the life of the tire by weakening the little knobs with cracks from both directions. That makes sense to me. I have run trials tires for many years and never flipped them.

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Flipping a trials tire is unecassary. They grip as the soft tire wraps itself around an object the little knobs pinch the surface they are traveling over. I would think that if you already have run a trials tire in one direction and created the cracks around the knob from that direction, flipping it would create cracks from the other direction thus shortening the life of the tire by weakening the little knobs with cracks from both directions. That makes sense to me. I have run trials tires for many years and never flipped them.

Exactly what I was thinking.

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Yep, a lot of the guys at the local events flip them on their trials bikes. I flipped mine once on the big bike when I ripped out a valve stem and had the tire almost off anyway. As was mentioned there is not a huge difference in traction from new to worn so I don't make a point to flip mine unless I have it off for some reason. The one I did flip shows no sign of unusual wear.

Later,

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speaking of cracking. on my dunlop, every single little knob has cracking all the way around the base. seems lots of wear left on the tread though, and I haven't had any come all the way off yet. Is that typical for these? would you replace it?

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The typical Trials Tire on a Trials Bike tends to wear all of the edges more evenly because there is as much braking as there is power application in a typical Trials Ride. And because we run the air pressure much lower than most dirtbikes, the tire body plays a more important part in the traction game AND the knobs tend to work WITH the tire body instead of getting twisted from the tire body.

If you are running the higher pressures (8 PSI and above) and using more power than braking, you are most likely putting more emphasis on the knobs in your traction program and might then benefit from flipping the tire. At higher pressures, the tire body stays round and firm and then more of the total flex is transfered to the knobs. At lower pressures (6 PSI and lower), the tire lays down a flat contact patch that shapes to the ground surface, so the knobs and tire body work together... It's a Radial Ply Tire and that's what they do best at low pressures.

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speaking of cracking. on my dunlop, every single little knob has cracking all the way around the base. seems lots of wear left on the tread though, and I haven't had any come all the way off yet. Is that typical for these? would you replace it?

That is completely normal, mine usually start cracking at 200 miles. The first one didn't start shedding knobs until 1400 miles. The second one started at 900 miles but it had 2 ISDE's and the 6 hour team race at Eddieville, it was still working fine with 1/4 of the center knobs missing. It had much harder miles on it.

Later,

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My buddy with a 803 on a WR250 Husqvarna was pitching knobs at 600 miles. Not sure how Jake manages 1400. Maybe it is a 2 stroke thing?

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Yep, I don't ever get the 1500 to 2000 miles out of a trials tire. I will start throwing knobs at 600 to 900 miles and I replace them immediately after a knob or two is missing. My knobby tires only last about 500 to 600 miles. Anymore I buy trials for performance not longevity. They do last a bit longer than a knobby but not much.

The Michelin seemed to last the longest. The IRC did not last any longer than a knobby. The Dunlop seems to be holding up pretty good on my KDX220. I have yet to try a Perrelli.

My four strokes eat trials tires up about as fast as a knobby. I have a trials tire for my KX500 but I think it will eat it like my 525 and XR650R do. The big bore 4 strokes can break the trials tire loose too easily and thats what contributes to their wear. They are made to get traction and not spin in the rocks or what have you. Also, sustained high speed seems to break the trials tires down quickly.

I still find trials tires worth it and will continue to use them although I still purchase knobbies for some kinds of riding.

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My buddy with a 803 on a WR250 Husqvarna was pitching knobs at 600 miles. Not sure how Jake manages 1400. Maybe it is a 2 stroke thing?

I think it may have something to do with his aggressive riding on the gravel...

Plus I ride really slow. :thumbsup:

Mostly I think it is the way the 250f's put down power.

Later,

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If you are running the higher pressures (8 PSI and above) and using more power than braking, you are most likely putting more emphasis on the knobs in your traction program and might then benefit from flipping the tire. At higher pressures, the tire body stays round and firm and then more of the total flex is transfered to the knobs. At lower pressures (6 PSI and lower), the tire lays down a flat contact patch that shapes to the ground surface, so the knobs and tire body work together... It's a Radial Ply Tire and that's what they do best at low pressures.

This is what I was thinking...thanks for the insights. I will flip the tire when I put it back on.

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How much the tire distorts also depends on the speed the tire hits the object. At trials pace you need low pressure, but at enduro pace your hitting the object harder and can distort the tire the same amount using higher pressure. I air mine based on the speed of the ride, which i kinda learned the hard way after riding a superfast harescramble at 8psi and pounding 1/2 my spokes loose.

The dunlop is molded slightly undersize to hold the rim better (a little harder to mount). 1 rim lock is plenty.

To keep the tube from walking use lot's of talc powered on the tube and in the tire. Then seal the valves stem and rimlock with silicon so no water or grit gets in the tire. May seem counterproductive, but what your trying to do is eliminate any traction between the tube and tire.

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Plus I ride really slow. :thumbsup:

Your a really fast slow guy.

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I air mine based on the speed of the ride, which i kinda learned the hard way after riding a superfast harescramble at 8psi and pounding 1/2 my spokes loose.

I did the same thing, started the Devils Head ISDE last year with 6psi in the rear. It was supposed to be the hardest event of the year, in the trask that is known for technical riding so I planned accordingly. The first 10 miles were probably 25mph average on old logging roads with water bars. The bike was wanting to swap ends over them. :thumbsup:

I put 12 psi in at the first check point and was much better off.

Later,

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I saw on another forum where guys are getting more life out of the tire by drilling a hole in the center of each knob to improve cooling when riding on pavement and gravel. Seems like a lot of work to me.

Has anyone ran the Michelin Bias ply Tire? does it work good? I have ran the radial.

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The typical Trials Tire on a Trials Bike tends to wear all of the edges more evenly because there is as much braking as there is power application in a typical Trials Ride. And because we run the air pressure much lower than most dirtbikes, the tire body plays a more important part in the traction game AND the knobs tend to work WITH the tire body instead of getting twisted from the tire body.

If you are running the higher pressures (8 PSI and above) and using more power than braking, you are most likely putting more emphasis on the knobs in your traction program and might then benefit from flipping the tire. At higher pressures, the tire body stays round and firm and then more of the total flex is transfered to the knobs. At lower pressures (6 PSI and lower), the tire lays down a flat contact patch that shapes to the ground surface, so the knobs and tire body work together... It's a Radial Ply Tire and that's what they do best at low pressures.

traction and PSI is also relative to rider weight don't forget. at 280lbs, I would destroy my tire, tube and rim probably if I ran it at anything below ten PSI :thumbsup:

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