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96-2010 DR650SE Fuel Injection Project....

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lmao! I don't know how you expect to keep it on the road. If it was me, I'd be like a high school girl driving around with a fancy new cellphone. Only prying my eyes away from the screen for a moment to make hasty corrections with the steering wheel.:banana:

For Pete's sake be careful!

So unbelievably cool:thumbsup:

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lmao! I don't know how you expect to keep it on the road. If it was me, I'd be like a high school girl driving around with a fancy new cellphone. Only prying my eyes away from the screen for a moment to make hasty corrections with the steering wheel.:eek:

For Pete's sake be careful!

So unbelievably cool:thumbsup:

LOL! Yeah, those crazy phone texting drivers got nothing on me. :banana:

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I've been pulling my hair out trying to figure out where my controller resets were coming from. I was afraid it was hall sensor related but found out after reveiwing the data logs it was not..... the sensor signal was steady as a rock. Hmmm, so I started looking to the usual suspects of EMF noise on the wiring.... but I had done all of the noise cancelling things I have read about during the install attempting to avoid those pitfalls.... except one thing :lol: I bought those hot rod Nology Silverstone plugs when I bought my coil from them. Much ballyhoo'd but much junk for an electronic ignition system evidently. In a last ditch effort before I vis.gif I dug my old CR10EK's out of the bin and stuck them back in.

Instant perfection! I took the bike out for a long ride... runs fantastic. ;)

So I had built an ignition table a few days ago and I got thinking about having no IAC valve (idle air control) to keep the engine running when it's cold.... many of the FI doer's say it really isn't needed but I thought it would be cool. So looking at my ignition table I decided to try my own speed control. Advancing spark increase engine speed..... sooo, I took the second RPM bin of the table and set it at a 1400 RPM target. The first RPM bin is set at 1000 to cover those times when you take off from a light and really thump thump the engine down low or are out on a tight trail. So at the 0 TPS bin and 1000 RPM bin I set the timing to 12 degrees instead of the normal 10 degrees for idle. What this does is advance the timing if the engine begins to fall below 1400 RPM.... all bins are extrapolated from point to point so the transition is smooth and as the engine RPM catches back up the timing goes back to normal. Works like a friggin charm. :eek:

Here's a visual instead of :lol:

Ignition_Table1.JPG

I feel like a kid in a candy store with all these widgits and things I can control... talk about expanding your tuning horizons. So I'm done dinking with ignition. There's really no point to putting much effort into the ignition table, beyond what I've already built, because as soon as I take control of fuel a good portion of the timing will likely need to be changed. I'm going to put some miles on the bike this weekend just to give the system a good burn in and see if any issues crop up. Then I start getting serious about fuel! :banana:

Edited by mx_rob

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Are the Nology Silvertones a resistor plug? I remember having major problems with interference and resets when using a non-resistor NGK even when the ECU was several feet from the engine. A resistor plug immediately eliminated the resets.

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Are the Nology Silvertones a resistor plug?

No! I had my16878235-Ti.gif firmly in place when I let Nology talk me into buying them. Not sure what you could actually use them on... certainly not a Microsquirt. I suspect they'd cause issues on a CDI system as well. :banana:

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So I was studying the data log from yesterday's ride looking at different sensor reactions.... as it is right now MAP is bad. I did all the adjustment I could to smooth it out but with wasted spark it's basically futile because I have to look at it every crankshaft rotation instead of every other on the intake stroke.... average MAP kpa is way too high so my fueling is way over the top. Some of this might be attributable to the FCR-MX's vacuum port location. Certainly not optimal for sensing manifold air pressure. Hopefully the signal will be much stronger yet less pulsey.... (is that a word?) with the FI throttle body to get that fueling down where it should be in the lower TPS bins. Certainly because of port location and the tiny diameter of the hole Suzuki uses in the port there will be a far different signal. Still, sequential injection is the answer... or at least the best chance of getting speed density (fueling governed by manifold air pressure as representative of engine load) to work properly.

Next I looked at my clt sensor (engine temp) readings. I have to say my Rube Goldberg copper cylinder head sensor gizmo works pretty darn good. Based on the readings I could disable the extended cooling range function that I have turned on. Recorded engine temps ramped up nicely and ended up swinging between 185 and 196 (highest recorded temp) based on my speed. I'll have to get a data log of freeway flying to see if more air flow will drive the temp down too far.... if it does then running in cooler temps with this set-up might present a problem. If that's the case I'll just end up using the extended clt range and a spark plug ring sensor set-up.

I'm going for a ride! :banana:

Edited by mx_rob

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Wow! I knew ignition control was going to be a good thing.... check this out.

67 miles on 1.17 gallons for 57.2 mpg! :banana: That was including a bunch of downtown Grand Rapids city driving, some highway 55-60 mph and some 70-75 mph freeway flying on 14/42 gearing. No changes to the FCR-MX at all. The best I've ever recorded before the Microsquirt ignition was 54 mpg. Based on this I see no problems at all getting over 60+ mpg once I get control of fuel.

Another thing I noticed riding around downtown with all the short stop and go slow riding was a big increase in thumpability... taking off from a stop sign/light the engine pulls lower r's way better... I can thump away below 1000 rpm and it pulls smoothly. It has to be the 36 tooth wheel and it's superior timing control. Crank inertia changes dramatically at lower RPM's in the fourstroke cycle. The stock CDI has only one long tooth and one short tooth for timing accuracy but the 36 tooth wheel on my bike breaks crankshaft positioning right down to 10 degree increments... so the Microsquirt only has to guess where the crank is in small window. Add to that a derivative predictor algorithm within the TS firmware and timing is spot on at all times.

After seeing the fuel mileage and how great the bike is running I treated it to a brand new set of CR10EK's as a reward..... I felt bad that it ran that great on plugs that were dug out of the trash can. ;)

So I can't stand it any more.... I've started tearing the bike apart to switch over to fuel control. :eek:

Edited by mx_rob

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I've got the bracket made to mount the R450 fuel pump to the frame where my old CA smog valve mounted. I also modified the fuel rail on the TB so I could use all of the stock R450 fuel lines and connectors. The regulator sits sideways below the TB which points all the connectors in just the right direction... I'll have to work on a mount for that later. It all fits.... not much room left but it fits! :banana: The fuel rail clears the backbone of the frame at the seat junction, after I modified it, by about 3/8". Now I have to make a custom T for the fuel pump vent/flood line, the regulator by-pass line, the fuel filter/surge tank vent line and the tank return line..... hey wait a minute... 1,2,3,4... correction. I have to make a custom H. :lol: Like I said the fuel is going to be the easy part (at least getting it installed anyway) I hope to have this thing running on fuel this weekend! :eek:;)

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So I had built an ignition table a few days ago and I got thinking about having no IAC valve (idle air control) to keep the engine running when it's cold.... many of the FI doer's say it really isn't needed but I thought it would be cool. So looking at my ignition table I decided to try my own speed control. Advancing spark increase engine speed..... sooo, I took the second RPM bin of the table and set it at a 1400 RPM target. The first RPM bin is set at 1000 to cover those times when you take off from a light and really thump thump the engine down low or are out on a tight trail. So at the 0 TPS bin and 1000 RPM bin I set the timing to 12 degrees instead of the normal 10 degrees for idle. What this does is advance the timing if the engine begins to fall below 1400 RPM.... all bins are extrapolated from point to point so the transition is smooth and as the engine RPM catches back up the timing goes back to normal. Works like a friggin charm.

Hey Rob, haven't check in here in a while, glad to see you are making great progress. Also glad to see your now running the Extra code, I think you'll be happy with that choice, I've been running the 303u code for quite a while now. Anyways, I wanted to mention on the above quoted issue, I believe there is a special menu if you look in the extended settings under "idle advance" and also "idle advance timing" I believe it does exactly what your accomplishing above but without needing to use up some of your ingnition table. I'm still not running ignition yet, but I've read about it before and it clicked into my brain when I read your post above.

Also all your MAP issues will go away when you get the cam sensor going, it's a must for SD, I would run straight Alpha-N until you get that setup. Also not sure what your planning for a fuel pressure regulator but I'm running a non-referenced regulator meaning the pressure doesn't change in relation to MAP, I see alot of motorcycles OEM are this way and it is probably because of the MAP issue at low RPM's. Running it this way with basically a constant fuel pressure makes the VE table need to accomodate more of a spread in fueling but it hasn't been an issue on my setup. Just some food for thought, your setup may work differently, but the way I see it a map referenced FPR will have problems with the wild map signal and could lead to inconsistent fueling, at least with a constant pressure setup you have repeatability and that is really all that matters.

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I'm sorry to tell you mx-rob but Suzuki will be bringing out the DRFI 650 for 2012 bassed on your findings. You've done all the hard work for them.:banana: So now could you start work on the seat and suspension thanks.

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Hey Rob, haven't check in here in a while, glad to see you are making great progress. Also glad to see your now running the Extra code, I think you'll be happy with that choice, I've been running the 303u code for quite a while now. Anyways, I wanted to mention on the above quoted issue, I believe there is a special menu if you look in the extended settings under "idle advance" and also "idle advance timing" I believe it does exactly what your accomplishing above but without needing to use up some of your ingnition table. I'm still not running ignition yet, but I've read about it before and it clicked into my brain when I read your post above.

Also all your MAP issues will go away when you get the cam sensor going, it's a must for SD, I would run straight Alpha-N until you get that setup. Also not sure what your planning for a fuel pressure regulator but I'm running a non-referenced regulator meaning the pressure doesn't change in relation to MAP, I see alot of motorcycles OEM are this way and it is probably because of the MAP issue at low RPM's. Running it this way with basically a constant fuel pressure makes the VE table need to accomodate more of a spread in fueling but it hasn't been an issue on my setup. Just some food for thought, your setup may work differently, but the way I see it a map referenced FPR will have problems with the wild map signal and could lead to inconsistent fueling, at least with a constant pressure setup you have repeatability and that is really all that matters.

Thanks for the feedback. Yeah, I saw that idle advance feature in the 3.03u code.... I had built this advance table when I first started out with 2.1 code... which I switched to after 2.890 ... I can't make up my mind. :lol: I have ADD.. like a pack rat... one shiny item catches my eye and I drop everything. ;)

I'm using the R450's regulator which is a constant pressure regulator AFAIK. There is nothing but two fuel line fittings and one by-pass fitting on it.

Because I'm a masochist I want to dink around with SD just to see how bad it's going to be... but I know the serious operation will be with alpha-n on wasted spark. I figure I can put some more time into VR2 once the riding season goes to heck in a hand basket. :banana:

Thanks for checking back in... always good to have some experienced squirters in the audience mix. :eek:

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I'm sorry to tell you mx-rob but Suzuki will be bringing out the DRFI 650 for 2012 bassed on your findings. You've done all the hard work for them.:banana: So now could you start work on the seat and suspension thanks.

:lol: Damn pirates anyway! :lol:

Seat? I have a Renazco... my seat is done. ;)

Suspension? The DRZ shock is sitting on the work bench in the exact same location I placed it months ago. :eek:

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Speaking of more coolness... The stock pull cable on the DR650 works perfectly on the R450 throttle body after backing off the cable adjuster at the throttle grip. Nice! There is no push cable set-up on the TB.

Edited by mx_rob

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Also not sure what your planning for a fuel pressure regulator but I'm running a non-referenced regulator meaning the pressure doesn't change in relation to MAP, I see alot of motorcycles OEM are this way and it is probably because of the MAP issue at low RPM's. Running it this way with basically a constant fuel pressure makes the VE table need to accomodate more of a spread in fueling but it hasn't been an issue on my setup. Just some food for thought, your setup may work differently, but the way I see it a map referenced FPR will have problems with the wild map signal and could lead to inconsistent fueling, at least with a constant pressure setup you have repeatability and that is really all that matters.

Yeah, I went the same way. It seems to work fine on my setup. All of the in-tank pumps I have seen do not reference the FPR to MAP. The YZF R6 TBs I used had an external regulator and it did reference to MAP, but as you say, I think repeatability is more important.

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Hi mx_rob, I've been peeking at this thread for a while, but now the time has come to register and tell you this: you're awesome.

Since I bought my first thumper (1996 DR800s) a few months ago I've been looking at those carbs (the BIG DR has dual CV carbs and dual spark) and the crude ignition thinking.....this bike could run so much better. Why sink 600+ euro's into yet another set of carbs when you can enter the 21st century with FI and computer controlled spark. So, thanks for the info and inspiration. I'm really excited to see the "finished" product and hope to start my own FI project soon.

Keep up the good work!! :banana:

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