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How to remedy x-ring chain rub on case?

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I slapped a Primary Drive gold x-ring chain on my 05 along with a Primary Drive 50th. sprocket. While pushing it around or coasting along there doesn't appear to be any rub. In fact, I can slide a piece of paper between the case and chain for the most part. However I finally took it out for a 1/2 mile run up the street and when I took my helmet off, I could hear and "see" that under mild acceleration the chain rubs the case. I removed the chain to clean up what little shavings were there, as well as the case itself for picture taking purposes. It appears as thought it rubbed a little all the way around, but the only area where you can actually feel any sort grooving is up at the top size, leading edge there in the pics below. It doesn't FEEL bad, but I have no idea how thick the case is in this area...any ideas?

How do you PROPERLY remedy this...shim made for the intended purpose, different CS, or different chain? I think there was a DID VT series o or x ring chain that was made for this situation, but I think they are discontinued? I'd really like to keep the chain if at all possible, but I don't want to risk putting it too far out of line with the rear sprocket, and I don't want to lose my CS while on the trail. I've read horror stories about losing the CS with spacers, and I know running the two out of line with each other will cause wear. Also, what is involved in removing the CS...I read that there is some sort of spring or something behind it? Details appreciated, and of course I will check my service manual.

BTW, I also noticed that the leading edge of the outer most lugs on my stock rear tire on the drive side was chewed up some. Since it was used, it could have been this way before, but I didn't notice it. The only way I could get contact between the two was to physically push the chain as far as I could in that direction, and even then it was very slight...I don't see how it would do this under normal riding conditions. I do have the chain set at about 1 1/2" of slack while I'm sitting on it, but I think that's about where the CRF450R is suppose to be is it not?

CLICK TO VISIT LINK, THEN CLICK AGAIN TO ENLARGE

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OK...so I found this, which I do remember reading the night I got my bike, but which method is ideal? Are there any downsides to using the 02-04 washer in place of the collar and spring washer? Why did Honda switch to this? I think I am going to try the valve shim first so I can start with a thinner one. Would I just want to put a second one of same thickness between the front of the CS and spring washer to keep it from shattering, or? Is the Fastway spacer hardened or shaped any differently to make it work better than a valve shim?

" Q:

Can I install an O-ring or X-ring chain on my 450R? I have heard that the wider links will rub the cases.

A:

A spacer is available from Fastway that goes between the countershaft sprocket and case that moves the sprocket outboard.On a 2002-2004 simply install the spacer behind the sprocket and torque the countershaft bolt. On the 2005-2007 the same retaining bolt was used but a drive collar and spring washer was used instead of the single washer on the previous years. When using the necessary Fastway spacer the spring washer can become over compressed and shatter. There are two solutions. The most simple is to order the OEM washer for the 2002-2004 years and use it in the place of the drive sprocket collar and spring washer. Part# 90501-KA3-741 for the 2002-2004 washer. The other solution is to place a washer on the front side of the sprocket the approximate thickness of the Fastway spacer positioned on the back of the sprocket to keep from over compressing the spring washer and torque the contershaft bolt. OR...

For spacing the countershaft sprocket when using O/X-Ring chains, instead of the Fastway spacer you can use a "Series 100" automotive valve spring shim, the inner diameter is a perfect fit, ask for 0.03 or 0.04 thickness (I think the Fastway is 0.04). Available at most any automotive machine shop for about 25 cents. I'm not sure who on here originally suggested this (ThrottleJockey maybe?) but it works perfectly and you don't have to wait for it to come in the mail.(Courtesey Matte)"

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need the 1mm spacer.

1mm = .04"

...since I already cut into the case some, should I not try a .03" first or has anyone done this with / without success?

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I removed the CS and found more wear on the case around the raised portion about 1/4" out from the seal. I filed it smooth and cleaned everything up with some WD40.

The CS fits the shaft perfectly so I hate to move it out very far. I think I'll go the valve shim route because they are more beefy than the Fastway spacer and I can get multiple thickness. The only problem is finding the appropriate size spacer for the outer side. I am looking the fancy aluminum 02-04 style washers, but I wonder how the aluminum would take the gap without filling it with the smaller washer. I'm assuming the OEM one is steel.

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The series 100 valve spring shims are available in .020" thickness. That's all that's usually required to clear the case. Next time just get a DID VT2 and forget the shim.

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I looked at the VT2 last night as I was just going to buy one from Rocky Mtn., but noticed it's a rivet type master link and I like to remove my chain for cleaning & lubing so that's out.

My sprocket is on properly...with the offset toward the outside.

If I run a .02" shim behind it, will I be alright running either the 02-04 front washer or one of the aluminum ones off ebay without having to hunt down something to shim out the gap in front of the shaft? Is the OEM front washer steel or Al.?

Anyone have any idea how thick the case is in this area? I can't believe it rubbed down by the damn seal too...I can take a pic if anyone is interested.

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I decided the best way to handle this would be to take the CS to a cylinder head shop for the series 100 20 thousandths spring shim and have them take the outer part of the CS down 20 thousandth thus eliminating the need for the second shim on the front side.

Only question now is, should I replace my CS bolt and wave washer or are they considered reusable?

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I don't know your bike, and I'm most likely wrong lol

but why would there be a offset on a sprocket if its on the outside? It wouldn't serve a purpose then right?

The only 2 bikes I've worked on with offsets, the offset went towards the inside factory..

But like I said I don't know your bike :thumbsup:

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Same here man, but it's opposite on the 05-07 (at least) CRF 450R's. Some people flip them and the use the old style single piece CS washer, but the 2-piece wave washer wouldn't work if it were flipped around.

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Same here man, but it's opposite on the 05-07 (at least) CRF 450R's. Some people flip them and the use the old style single piece CS washer, but the 2-piece wave washer wouldn't work if it were flipped around.

Just curious, but don't 450r's come with o-ring chains? x-ring shouldn't be any wider should it? or at least I never noticed, but I guess I really wouldn't be able to eye 1mm lol..

Do the factory bikes come with shims on the sprocket? Did you remove your shim?

I don't see why the chain would rub unless you changed something from factory, which in that case technically your sprockets wouldn't be tracking 100% right???

just asking questions here :thumbsup:

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I'm guessing you don't have a 450R? They come with standard racing chain...light weight & low resistance. No factory shim.

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BTW, the VT2 can be purchased with the removable master link instead of the rivet type.

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Same here man, but it's opposite on the 05-07 (at least) CRF 450R's. Some people flip them and the use the old style single piece CS washer, but the 2-piece wave washer wouldn't work if it were flipped around.

Yep, trust me on that one! See my active thread about the CS coming off!!

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BTW, the VT2 can be purchased with the removable master link instead of the rivet type.

which master link is the correct one for this... I just ordered the vt2 last night... also want the master link.

or is the rivet type better? do i need any special tools for the rivet type?

thanks!

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I'm guessing you don't have a 450R? They come with standard racing chain...light weight & low resistance. No factory shim.

i have two 450r's in the shed , the 08 still has the standard chain and it is a t-ring i belive and it rubs the case with only 20 hrs on it

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which master link is the correct one for this... I just ordered the vt2 last night... also want the master link.

or is the rivet type better? do i need any special tools for the rivet type?

thanks!

The rivet link is much stronger. In fact Broc Glover lost a race back in the 80's because a of a broken clip master link, and Team Yamaha has used nothing but rivets ever since.

A special chain press tool is required for installation, and some extra mechanical skill is too. I use an RK tool. When I press on the masterlink plate, I use a set of micrometers to match the same width as the rest of the chain. This is important so that you maintain the proper crush on the seals. Once that is done you use the chain tool to peen the rivets.

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I had my CS surface ground to .0004" tolerance last night. They removed .03" to compensate for the valve spring booster shim on the backside of the CS. You need a B100 or a Dura-Bond 3090 shim. They each mic out at .03"

This way you can still use the proper 2-pc. front washer setup. I will take pics in a day or three. If anyone needs a ground OEM CS with spacer, let me know...if the boards allow it that is.

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