smart performance saga continues

[ncmountainman]

just can't keep away,dave likens it to going whoring around and then coming back to the best:lol: (we'll see!)

when i ordered up my new ktm i'd heard great things about pauls suspension work at ktm world and figured i'd let them have a go at it and got their 'full monty' setup. i gotta tell ya the shock was the BEST shock i've ever ridden on (and ktm's are not known for rr end prowess).

they turn it into a bladder setup,change out the main piston,and have something called a superadjuster which replaces the h/s adjuster assmbly for more flow and range of adjustment. no complaints at all there....the fork on the other hand was good but not spectacular,after a few discussions and couple changes it was better but still lacking in a couple key areas,then after hearing it was me just being too picky(sounds familiar!) and there wasn't much else to be done i moved on to the supposed guru of wp,javier over at trail tricks;got the full on 'magic carpet ride' setup. now i gotta tell ya i've never been so thoroughly interigated by a tuner before and was expecting some kinda greatness considering that and all the 'magic carpet ride' hype over at ktm talk.....well it did address one of my major issues with the ktm world setup (blowing through) but has a few quirks of its own most of which i've dialed out, but the range of adjustment on these trail trick forks is just so tight they are hard to get a 'overall' feeling of confidence and your constantly trying to adjust something out only to gain a new issue. don't get me wrong both these setups are quite better than stock with the trail tricks being the one allowing for more speed but at the cost of adjustability range.

so i picked up a set of new carts that someone has taken out of a 2010 sx450 (they put in ohlins) and sent them to dave as he assures me that all of my issues of blowing through with his previous setups have been addressed without getting stiff and deflecty on the roots and such,hmmmmm ok.

the best setup i've had with the digressive damping was a set of phase4's i got from a fellow TT'er that had setup the bv blowoff with a lift limit of .5 mm...the setup was an exact duplicate of a previous setup i'd ran but for the limit,so i know that was the only difference. dave doesn't like the limit idea and is sticking to his guns but i can't get over how well it worked and can't wait to see if he actually has cured the problem or if its just the proverbial smoke:smirk:

after i sold my sh500af i installed those p4's with the limit in my buddies wr and he's loving them also

Edited March 2, 2010 by ncmountainman

[Bushmechanic]

Bob if there was ever a guy who could gain a great deal of personal satisfaction from becoming a really good tuner I reckon you're it ?

still waiting for those TCS but its getting closerer. did you get those conevalve parts?

[ncmountainman]

Bob if there was ever a guy who could gain a great deal of personal satisfaction from becoming a really good tuner I reckon you're it ?

still waiting for those TCS but its getting closerer. did you get those conevalve parts?

ya,i'm sure its gonna boil down to self reliance and i've assembled all the tools i need for the bladder forks;gonna start experimenting with the trail tricks fork and i'm hoping dave has a pretty good baseline figured by now for my starting point going back into the phase 4 endeavor. i think the bladder fork will work well with the phase 4 as its not so particular to the higher oil levels i've needed to run in the past digressive setups.

i really like the idea behind those TCS you guys are working on and would like to give it a try when its ready,the conevalve thing went on hiatus as my guy went to south africa for their race season....don't know when thats over with? but conevalve,,,phase4 ..... six one half dozen of the other:thumbsup:

[mog]

i am glad i dont do your suspension ?

[ncmountainman]

i am glad i dont do your suspension ?

you do in way:thumbsup: got the World Wide Whip goin on here,sooner or later sumthin's gonna gel....either that or i'll run out of options.

worst case scenario its all an expensive edjucation in futility:p

[shockdoc]

i am glad i dont do your suspension

I've thought that before myself. ?

doc

[ncmountainman]

you fellers just can't stand a challenge:smirk:

it ain't me,,, daves already said there were issues in the area i was experiencing problems with my earlier setups.

one of the things i've learned over the yrs is not to spout off about how good a setup is only to find out later that its not. the biggest problem i had with the p4's and the taco's was blowing through at the time when support was needed most.....seemed as though it was in the transition from a hs hit going into the ls part of the stroke would just 'go away' it was rather dangerous and caused me a couple of injuries. apparantly you lighter folk don't have this problem so its always picky,picky mtnman;glad i'm not his tuner......please forgive my ignorance of wanting a suspension thats not gonna fold up like an accordian:moon:

Edited March 4, 2010 by ncmountainman

[mog]

its not that you are wrong to want it, its just its wrong to think we have the answer...i think someone of your stature would normally have to accept a rough ride,and be very fit and strong, like a ama pro for example, they would sacrifice the plushness for control, you want both which we all do, its just for someone like me at 160lb thats not too hard, for you if you look at your weight vs bike its so different, i am 5 foot 6 inch so i dont have much leverage either, you do....just limits on what can be achieved, you would not believe how bad some pros suspension is.

[harrperf]

If you truly watch top pros...the bike is all over the place. They just have the skill and composure to make it look easy.

There IS a limit to what can be acheived within 12 inches of travel....trying to kid yourself otherwise is just futile.

Have we reached that limit? No, as that computer controlled suspension shows. However ultimately some bumps must be felt, and sometimes the bike must leave the ground (like a jump)

[Bushmechanic]

There IS a limit to what can be acheived within 12 inches of travel....trying to kid yourself otherwise is just futile.

yep my bike came with 11.2 now I have 12.7" ?

NC could prolly use 14" on the forks before his ride felt like it does for us lil uns

its gonna be hard to fine springs that will handle that and still fit inside the forks but thats what Id do if nothing else worked

[ncmountainman]

i don't blame anyone for not having the answer,in fact its quite the opposite....i'm totally understanding of my unique position of being probly 1 in 1000(there is someone in germany using daves stuff with the same stature and is having the same issues),and i totally understand that people who do this for a living really don't owe me anything more than the next feller with $300 for a revalve. its not like i randomly choose a tuner use'em up and throw'em away, i like to think that the we might actually learn from each other in the process of trying to solve my problems. i keep records of every setup from every tuner i've ever worked with and i'd like to think i've got a pretty good handle on whats working for me and whats not,i would also like to think that in solving some of my problems it would carry over to everyone else in some way, shape, or form.... so its not just all about me.

i've always joked with people someone my size riding at A class pace generates forces equal to or in excess of the pro riders....its probly not that far from the truth.

and i've got no problem with 'feeling' the bumps its the deflection that worries me, in fact i rather like a active setup.

i'm gonna try bushy's advice on lengthening the travel on my other set of carts,i'm fairly sure i can get 5mm easy enough:thumbsup:

all in all i believe dave loves a good challenge,if he didn't he would have just sent me packin':ride:

Edited March 5, 2010 by ncmountainman

[slothspeed]

You are to big for the bike. My 110 pound son has a ttr125 small wheel and a kx100. Neither fits me at 5'10" 185 in street clothes. Sure I could modify one of them forever and make it continually better for me but there is a limit. I really think you need a bigger/stronger bike with more travel. The problem I see is a bike like that has never been designed.

I do admire you never settling though.

[Bushmechanic]

I don't think any one of the guys doing work for NC has exhausted all of the possibilites for him nor would any of them likely say they've stopped testing and improving and won't get any better at what they do anymore so theres still a chance hes gonna get what he wants.

Edited March 5, 2010 by Bushmechanic

[mog]

trouble is also cost and time, with the best will in the world, for your $300 to $900 you can only expect so much, we pay $$$$$ for a new bike and it doesnt work that well, so it must come to a point where we say i am sorry but for the money its the best i can achieve, pros have a dedicated tuner work with them for weeks or even months, it sometimes takes that level of dedication to get the results, i am not knocking anyone in this thread just stating the issues of this special case.

[ncmountainman]

well i've come across plenty of people with that attitude after the fact.

fact being when someone enters into a contract with the obligatory 'yes we can,send it in' even after being apprised of all the previous trials and tribulations of other tuners not being able to (which is almost always met with 'we can') they take the money with empty promises,then when they fall short....'its the best we can do' i go on down the line for the next load of crap.....quite honestly its getting old,and just adds to their own stagnation.

at least dave will man up to the fact that yes we've discovered there were some issues with your previous setups that could have contributed to some shortcomings. i see this not only with me but all his customers getting more than expected attention until they are satisfied,i really don't know how he does it but its certainly commendable.

one of the last tuners charged pretty good money and never even changed the comp stack on the stock mv,,,when called out for more hs progression he added a shim to the bv;that was the best he could do....next:banghead:

[harrperf]

Let's be real.

For the amount of money you have spent, at this point, you could have built your own set of forks with every design element YOU want in them (or your tuner)

Why not do that?

[ncmountainman]

Let's be real.

For the amount of money you have spent, at this point, you could have built your own set of forks with every design element YOU want in them (or your tuner)

Why not do that?

its like going to the doctor...your assuming he knows more than you and kindly pay him for his knowledge.

although, i'm constantly reminded that this is america and one can get by with a good load of crap over substance;i'm hoping to find someone who actually knows more than i do.....it really shouldn't be as hard as all that:busted:

seriously though, i do have a couple theories of my own and my next investment is gonna be a good milling machine/lathe combo.

[meyer1son]

Any videos of you riding on you tube?

[ncmountainman]

not that i know of,everyone tells me i have a smooth deliberate riding style;i've been riding since i was 6 so theres not much chance in changing it now....if i had to start thinking while riding it'd screw me all up:busted:

[MRW]

Dude, you sold "Black Beauty?!!? Uncontionable!!