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Even More Rekluse Questions!!!!!

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I feel like I must be missing something painfully obvious, but here it goes....

Just installed the Rekluse z-start clutch tonight and I have a few questions that I could not find answered elsewhere.

Question #1

I have read a lot about people using 24 or 27 balls, instead of the recommended 30. I can't find anywhere in the installation instructions or the Rekluse website that mentions anything about running less then 30 balls. Why run less then 30? Forgive me if this is common knowledge by now, but where can I find more information about this?

Question #2

I read many posts about proper clutch cable adjustment. The kit I purchased eliminates the clutch cable and lever all together. In some youtube videos I can see that the bike still has the lever attached and it's not flopping around like the cable has been disconnected. Maybe they have the EXP and not the Z-start?

Question #3

To setup my clutch properly (engagement speed and rpm) Rekluse has supplied me with two springs - one heavier and one lighter spring. Rekluse manual calls them "medium" spring and "light" spring. Where's this "heavy" spring I keep reading about?

Question #4

Tonight I did some test riding (it's a pain in the ass to roll start), I'm not sure if it was enough for a thorough break-in because it still doesn't operate correctly. But, I followed the installation instructions to the proverbial "T" and cannot get the bike to idle in first gear - it lurches forward and dies. Even with the bike off and in gear the clutch still drags. I know that Rekluse recommends Rotella T, but can running 80w/90 gear oil cause the clutch to drag too much and die when I put it in gear? Another guy, with the same problem, he said he just rode it around and then it started functioning like it should (he also had to do a roll start). For the record I have checked the installed gap clearance and all the clutch plates are new (including the steel plates behind the thinner Rekluse steel plates). Anyone else experience a similar problem?

I'm sure I have more questions but these seem to be bugging me the most.

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I have the manual overide kit with my z-start clutch (original model), so it retains the cable and lever. If you want this, you just need to fork out a little more money. I find the manual overide usefull on a motocross track.

When you say "roll start" I assume that you have to get the bike rolling (by peddling Fred Flintstone style) before putting it in gear so it won't stall. Try the Rotella - if that doesn't solve the problem, then possibly you have some warped plates (assuming that you've installed the clutch perfecto mundo as you've stated).

Mine had to be re-adjusted (the plate clearances) after about 1 hour of riding, but it did not display the charateristics that you have. Since then, I've ridden with it for years and never had to re-adjust or perform any maintenance.

Edited by holeshot

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I am no expert, but I do have a rekluse pro in my bike.

Question #1

I have read a lot about people using 24 or 27 balls, instead of the recommended 30. I can't find anywhere in the installation instructions or the Rekluse website that mentions anything about running less then 30 balls. Why run less then 30? Forgive me if this is common knowledge by now, but where can I find more information about this?

I think it would just allow the clutch to engage smoother. Totally guessing here. I think maybe the pro has 27 balls and you can go to 24 for smoother engagement. Its been a while since I installed it so I dont recall exactly, but I remember the "27 or 24" information in my installation instructions.

Question #2

I read many posts about proper clutch cable adjustment. The kit I purchased eliminates the clutch cable and lever all together. In some youtube videos I can see that the bike still has the lever attached and it's not flopping around like the cable has been disconnected. Maybe they have the EXP and not the Z-start?

The z-start PRO has a clutch override. thats what they are talking about.

Question #3

To setup my clutch properly (engagement speed and rpm) Rekluse has supplied me with two springs - one heavier and one lighter spring. Rekluse manual calls them "medium" spring and "light" spring. Where's this "heavy" spring I keep reading about?

I had the same question when I installed mine. I think you have to buy it separately from rekluse.

Question #4

Tonight I did some test riding (it's a pain in the ass to roll start), I'm not sure if it was enough for a thorough break-in because it still doesn't operate correctly. But, I followed the installation instructions to the proverbial "T" and cannot get the bike to idle in first gear - it lurches forward and dies. Even with the bike off and in gear the clutch still drags. I know that Rekluse recommends Rotella T, but can running 80w/90 gear oil cause the clutch to drag too much and die when I put it in gear? Another guy, with the same problem, he said he just rode it around and then it started functioning like it should (he also had to do a roll start). For the record I have checked the installed gap clearance and all the clutch plates are new (including the steel plates behind the thinner Rekluse steel plates). Anyone else experience a similar problem?

Did you check the gaps with the little "S" looking guages exactly as they tell you to in the installation instructions? Those gaps have to be exactly perfect.

Also, I vaguely remember that perhaps you needed to use one less plate in some installations. My memory is foggy though..

All that said, with my pro, I have bad dragging with my clutch if the oil gets really cold and thick in below freezing tempuratures(I run rotella). So try rotella in warm conditions and see if that helps, the thick oil could very well be the problem.

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less balls makes it engage smoother or slip longer before total engagement. yes you order extra springs from rekluse. thicker oil will effect the engagement.you should have spent a little more for the pro it is that much easier to get right.

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Thanks guys for all the responses! Charles, at Rekluse, agreed that the gear oil is most likely causing the clutch drag. He also mentioned that the riding I did may not have been enough to properly break-in the clutch. So, as you guys have suggested, I will change the oil with Rotella T, do a thorough break-in, and report back.

Thumpin71, are the "S" shaped gauges included with the kit? I used some feeler gauges and inserted them 180 degrees apart and measured .82 millimeters. I will definitely be re-checking the installed gap after the break-in.

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Thanks guys for all the responses! Charles, at Rekluse, agreed that the gear oil is most likely causing the clutch drag. He also mentioned that the riding I did may not have been enough to properly break-in the clutch. So, as you guys have suggested, I will change the oil with Rotella T, do a thorough break-in, and report back.

Thumpin71, are the "S" shaped gauges included with the kit? I used some feeler gauges and inserted them 180 degrees apart and measured .82 millimeters. I will definitely be re-checking the installed gap after the break-in.

Using feeler gauges is the correct way with the Z-Start. Thumpin was referring to the Z-Start Pro which comes with the Go-No Go wire gauges.

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Happy to report that I finally got the clutch to behave properly! When I changed the oil the bike still died when placed into first. I then adjusted the (light) spring tension to almost it's maxed out position (as much tension as I could get out of it) and it worked!!!

After test riding it around the neighborhood I liked it a lot but I'm starting to doubt it's benefits.

I should explain a little - this last weekend I rode at Johnson Valley (off of camp rock road). There was a bunch of areas (perhaps more suited to a trials bike) where I needed low rpm throttle response to quickly loft the front tire over and around rocks. Personally, I like popping the clutch to help get the front tire up. Because I don't have a clutch lever I feel a bit skeptical that the auto clutch can reliably do the job.

Maybe my jetting is not spot on yet, but, shouldn't I be able to accelerate hard from a dead stop without the bike coughing? I guess I'm looking for the more 'solid' engagement feel of a standard clutch.

I will soon get the chance to try it in the dirt but was hoping to hear from some of you guys about it's pros and cons in slow, tight, technical, rocky terrain. And for you guys that are using my same configuration (no clutch lever/cable) - have you felt the need to add the Z-start perch adjuster to get your clutch lever back?

Edited by jspicket

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susco64 is right, I have the pro and was refering to the wire gauges.

jspicket, it sounds like all you want is the antistall properties out of the clutch, but want the same feel, hard hit, and lever control as a regular clutch.

The Rekluse that you want is the new EXP. Apparently it feels and acts exactly like a normal clutch, but has the anti-stall properties.

I know that with the Pro I have there are ways to make the hit a lot harder through the use different combinations springs and balls. I love the smooth engagement when the terrain gets nasty, slippery, etc.

I can tell you that my bike lost a lot of its "hit" when I put my rekluse in, but for me it was easy to get back with the use of my clutch lever (I have the pro). The clutch lever does not ever feel the same as before though, I will say that.

Note: I have never tried the EXP... I have only read about it... so dont take my word as gospel!

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And for you guys that are using my same configuration (no clutch lever/cable) - have you felt the need to add the Z-start perch adjuster to get your clutch lever back?

I have the same Z-start as you on my 08 450 and have always had the optional Perch Adjuster with it. I wouldn't want to have the Rekluse without it. I find myself needing that lever to slip, or get an extra boost of rpm's. I would suggest getting the perch adjuster, it will do just what you describe that your missing. It works more stock like than most people give it credit for. I also have 2 bikes with the Pro model and you don't get the same high RPM engagement rate that you can get out of the externally adjustable Perch Adjuster. I like the Z-Start non Pro model w/ perch adjuster better actually.

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If memory serves, I thought that the "heavy" spring was when you used the light and medium together.

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I am pretty sure that all the installation/setup directions for the clutch are on the Rekluse website to download. A matrix breaks it down into engagement rate and engagment RPM which can be adjusted with # of ball bearings and different springs. Also they have recommended settings for MX and off road. I have the Rekluse Pro (uses stock clutch lever.) I believe it offers more adjustability than the EXP and cost $250 less.

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Willbilly, you would be correct. Rekluse had that section under "Z-start Pro Tuning Chart". Kind of odd that Rekluse didn't include any pertinent info in the Z-start section or even explain why it could be more beneficial to subtract balls from the pressure plate.

the perch adjuster is starting to sound more interesting!

Well guys, I finally had a chance to play in the dirt today. I'm not sold yet on the auto clutch, but brake sliding into corners is sooo much fun!

After a bit of test riding I realized how important it is to get your jetting and idle speed set correctly - makes all the difference. Starting your bike in gear is very cool too.

I think I will put my clutch lever back on to fool my friends!

Throughout the day the clutch worked fine, but it is a little noisy. I mean to say that I can hear when the clutch is slipping. Do your auto clutches do the same? (For the record I used Rotella T and added about 750ml's)

Delta41, wouldn't connecting both springs cause the clutch to engage much slower? What type of rider would that setup cater to?

Edited by jspicket
Couldn't sleep!

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I just installed the same setup on a WR450F and had the same issues last night test riding. A little more info in the instructions for a starting point would have been helpful. I have the soft spring on, and will try it at full tension. It just stinks having to pull off the exhaust to adjust the spring. I am going to have to try to sneak the perch adjuster past the wife.

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Jspicket, what made more difference in the clutch, the oil change or adjusting the spring? I tried adjusting the soft spring up all the way, but it still drags in gear and it is hard to downshift. I am running Yamalube 20W-50 oil. I got the impression that it would freewheel at idle, but it kind of always pulls like an auto transmission in a car. Is that what yours is like?

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Your engagement point is too low, or your idle is set too high possibly.

I have my pro set up the exact same way, where it drags just a bit. I did this by turning up the idle.

I like it like this because it helps to keep the stalling to minimum, but since I have the pro I just pull in the lever when I stop the bike and it disengages the clutch so I dont burn it out.

Edited by Thumpin71

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That did the trick! :thumbsup: I put the heavier spring on, and slowed the idle, and it worked even better than I expected! I will tweak it a little more, but I am a believer, now!:lol:

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