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Want More Power, Will Pipe Make Much of a Difference?

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I am pretty much happy about everything about my 250x. The only thing i want a little more of is power. I find my self waiting sometimes for the low end power to kick in and dont feel like feathering the clutch all the time. Do you think putting a powercore or something on this will make a significant difference and if it does will it be mostly low end or what?

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Pipes are one of the best marketing scams of all time. I am amazed that people spend several hundred dollars on a product that at best makes very little difference. The X needs a new muffler, I would find a stock R muffler and put an end cap on it. Next, CCC mods. If you need more power, twist the throttle.

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If a 450 is too much for you as it is for me....Try a big bore kit in your 250x. well worth the extra coin. I tried the athena 280 and it bolted right on with no hastles and it has much more power then it ever did. I was already running full ccc mod , the only thing I noticed was the top end or overrev was not there any more , but who cares. the bike has so much more power down low and midrange torque , that as long as your not on a mx track you;ll have a big smile on your face as you wheelie by your buddy in third gear . Even forth with a little tug on the bars.. I also noticed no more oil consumption and I'm sure the motor will last longer not having to rev it too the moon anymore. It actually changed my riding style in a good way. More traction and control.

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If a 450 is too much for you as it is for me....Try a big bore kit in your 250x. well worth the extra coin. I tried the athena 280 and it bolted right on with no hastles and it has much more power then it ever did. I was already running full ccc mod , the only thing I noticed was the top end or overrev was not there any more , but who cares. the bike has so much more power down low and midrange torque , that as long as your not on a mx track you;ll have a big smile on your face as you wheelie by your buddy in third gear . Even forth with a little tug on the bars.. I also noticed no more oil consumption and I'm sure the motor will last longer not having to rev it too the moon anymore. It actually changed my riding style in a good way. More traction and control.

problem with the big bore is that it is just harder on the motor and the longevity goes away.

if you put in a new top end, you might want to go to some motor guy in town and have him P&P you cyl. head.

i strongly recommend doing the CCC mods like previously stated above. i really don't think a pipe is really worth it, i was stupid enough to buy one, but i got a smokin' deal on it and plus it is quiet and light weight. but i would recommend putting your money to better use and buy something else. IMO

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Pipes are one of the best marketing scams of all time. I am amazed that people spend several hundred dollars on a product that at best makes very little difference. The X needs a new muffler, I would find a stock R muffler and put an end cap on it. Next, CCC mods. If you need more power, twist the throttle.

You obviously have not tried a decent pipe on a 250X !

I put a full MRD system on mine.

It has the short header design and it has more power and response everywhere in the rev range - probably why Dave doesnt need a "marketing scam" to sell his gear as it clearly works.

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I have a Dr D full system, 250R full system, and have ridden several other bikes with aftermarket exhaust. Sure it is slightly better. Proper jetting for $14.00 and gearing makes a bigger difference than the $600.00 you spent. If I was spending that much, it would definately be a big bore kit and no it doesnt decrease longevity. Changing the compression puts more stress on the motor. Changing the bore does not put more stress on the motor. Justify your several hundred dollar purchase but please dont tell anyone that your miniscule HP gain is worth several hundreds of dollars. If you want more power, twist the throttle.

Edited by MMotohead

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Yeah, I'm not a fan of spending $500+ on an exhaust system. Sure, you may get a little more power, but you can always do what I did. Get a new 05 R full exhaust system for $50 (that's not including the sparky), and an 06 R cam for $13 on ebay. With those mods and proper jetting I couldn't be happier.

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I have a Dr D full system, 250R full system, and have ridden several other bikes with aftermarket exhaust. Sure it is slightly better. Proper jetting for $14.00 and gearing makes a bigger difference than the $600.00 you spent. If I was spending that much, it would definately be a big bore kit and no it doesnt decrease longevity. Changing the compression puts more stress on the motor. Changing the bore does not put more stress on the motor. Justify your several hundred dollar purchase but please dont tell anyone that your miniscule HP gain is worth several hundreds of dollars. If you want more power, twist the throttle.

I dont need to justify my purchase to you or anyone else.

I have enough experience testing different exhaust designs on all sorts of engines to know the right combination makes a significant difference.

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I dont need to justify my purchase to you or anyone else.

I have enough experience testing different exhaust designs on all sorts of engines to know the right combination makes a significant difference.

How significant? HP wise?

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not trying to fuel the fire here but , adding more bob weight to the crank WILL put more stress on the connecting rod ( the added weight of the bigger piston puts more stress on the rod when the rod has to pull the piston down after its mass is accelerated up ) , there is no way around that but high quality rods like Falicon are available and recomended with bigbores , the only time more compression effects reliability is if the compression exceeds the octane of the fuel being used , ( if the engine is detonating its because the octane of the fuel is too low and the detonation is doing the damage not the compression ) you can get the same result from running 87 octane on stock compression in these engines, and dont forget most bigbores will increase the compression ratio of the engine unless deck height is increased or the piston has less dome or is dished to compesate , part of the power gain with the bigbore comes from the added compression they bring, also my pipes are alot less than $600

Edited by DH367

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How significant? HP wise?
you could look at it this way , put a stock X system on a R and see how much you loose , I havent done it but if someone wants to bring me a stock X system I will dyno it on a R and the loss will be in the 3 to4 HP range across the board

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I thought we were talking about putting an aftermarket pipe (or R pipe) on an X? I don't see how putting an X pipe on an R will be relevant.

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I thought we were talking about putting an aftermarket pipe (or R pipe) on an X? I don't see how putting an X pipe on an R will be relevant.

its to explain how much better a R or good aftermarket pipe is over the stock X pipe , it seems some people think that a aftermarket pipe is not much better than the R pipe or the X pipe for that matter , the problem is that some of the aftermarket pipe builders use the same header design as stock on the X pipes they build , that is why the power gains are minimal , exhaust tuning is give and take , if you want a big hp gain you will have to get rid of the stock lowend header and put on the whole R system or a aftermarket system with a R style header instead of one with basicly the same header as stock , two things wont work for big gains on the X 1. putting on half of the R system 2. putting on an aftermarket pipe that has a header the same dimentions as stock

Edited by DH367

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Hi Dave,

Having had your system on my X for a few months now I can fully back up what your trying to say above.

From reading most of the posts on TT I was expecting to loose a bit of torque down low because of your short R style header.

I recently spent a few days riding some of the steepest, rocky terrain we have over here in Australia and there is no way the bike has lost any bottom end - and this type of terrain really requires it.

The spread of torque seems to wider than before which works well with the wider spaced gear ratios on the X.

The way the bike rides is so much nicer.

Keep up the good work !!!

From my experience with performance exhausts on cars, the dyno doesnt allways tell the whole story. Sometimes different sytems will make very similar WOT dyno graphs but have very noticeably different responsiveness and "feel" on the road.

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Hi Dave,

Having had your system on my X for a few months now I can fully back up what your trying to say above.

From reading most of the posts on TT I was expecting to loose a bit of torque down low because of your short R style header.

I recently spent a few days riding some of the steepest, rocky terrain we have over here in Australia and there is no way the bike has lost any bottom end - and this type of terrain really requires it.

The spread of torque seems to wider than before which works well with the wider spaced gear ratios on the X.

The way the bike rides is so much nicer.

Keep up the good work !!!

From my experience with performance exhausts on cars, the dyno doesnt allways tell the whole story. Sometimes different sytems will make very similar WOT dyno graphs but have very noticeably different responsiveness and "feel" on the road.

yep, a good hill is the true test , a dyno is a great tool and can show you where differences are and help with design but like you said some graphs look similar but feel quite different in operation so it takes a combination of dyno and real world testing to design a good system for any application :banana:

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If you take the baffel out of the x can you will pretty much be within 1hp to 2hp of any aftermarket exhaust.

Just do what i did find an R can on craigslist... i grabbed one with a billet end cap and removable spark arrestor for 20 bucks.

I have always felt that aftermarket exhaust was such a waste of money.

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If you take the baffel out of the x can you will pretty much be within 1hp to 2hp of any aftermarket exhaust.

Just do what i did find an R can on craigslist... i grabbed one with a billet end cap and removable spark arrestor for 20 bucks.

I have always felt that aftermarket exhaust was such a waste of money.

you better check that on the dyno because it is not correct , not to mention the stock empty can with no baffel has a very unfavorable tone compared to a can with a perforated core and packing material , the stock R muffler is alot better choice , you are not alone , alot of people are turned off by the over priced exhaust on the market , that is why I started making affordable 4 stroke exhaust systems in the first place , systems that work at half the price of big name systems that come with a warranty that the other exhaust guys would laugh at , but you cant please every body , I have been on here a long time offering help and accurate advice to guys asking ? about getting more power from these bikes ,and when I see something stated that is not true I feel like I am helping people from being miss-informed , sorry but removing the baffel from the stock exhaust makes the thing louder and thats about it, getting within 2 hp of the highest power producing aftermarket system would be tough , but it might come close to doing it compared to the lowest power producing aftermarket system

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http://www.thumpertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=856142&highlight=mrd+dyno this pipe was designed to boost lowend on the new 250R

here is what a good pipe does compared to the stock 2010 R pipe , around 3hp gain on bottom and around 1.5 hp peak , you could put a stock X pipe on there with the baffel removed and it would be less everywhere than the stock pipe , this comparison shows that a good aftermarket pipe is quite a bit better than a stock R pipe and means that a good aftermarkt pipe would be Quite a bit better than the stock X pipe even with the baffle removed , and one more thing to remember is any other mods you do to your X will work to there full potencial with a good pipe where the stocker would keep them from doing so, I am posting this info because it seems like alot of guys want to make thier X run like a R

Edited by DH367

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