oil rings install??

[Rrage523]

Hey, I half way through a top end rebuild on my 02 250f and can't seem to get the cylinder to slide over the piston.

Its getting hung up on the oil rings. I'm pretty confident I have them all in the slot on the piston with the gaps in the correct spots and the wavy (middle ring) not overlapped at all but it seems like I can't compress them enough to slide into the cylinder.

The bottom inside of the skirt is tappered slightly and once I get the oil rings past that point it just stops sliding. (easily) Where the rings would now have to compress completlety.

My first thought was that I should use a little more force but I choose to stop and ask you guys for some tips and tricks to get the oil rings to slide into the cylinder.

[SUnruh]

you have something wrong.

those go pretty easy.

i would recommend. taking them off.

put the expander on.

put bottom oil ring on.

put top oil ring on.

try it again.

[meyer1son]

Put rings and 1 circlip onto piston. Put the piston into your cylinder on a workbench. Slide it into the cylinder just far enough to be able to slide the wrist pin in (but don't at this time) Next take the cylinder/piston and install it on the crank.

[Rrage523]

I scratched my head for awhile last night. Took them all off put them back on etc..... It was like Ground Hogs day and at 11pm I called it a night.

I used the search and read that a few others have the same issues but couldn't find any that posted there solutions to the problem.

I thought about trying that approach last night but it was getting to late and I was getting to tired.

Going the bench approach would you be able to slide the piston and oil rings into the cylinder but leave enough room for the wrist pin?

Can't hurt to try either because right now I'm at a stand still.

[dirtymunkey]

Did you put an adequate amount of motor oil on the first inch or so of the cylinder?? I had a tough time with it also until I read the manual again and realized i was supposed to lube the cylinder as well as the rings. Then I was able to compress the rings with my hand enough that the piston slid right in.

[Rrage523]

Yeah, I remembered to oil the piston, rings and cylinder.

I even tried the rings separately, First made sure the 2 outside rings would slide into the cylinder (worked), removed those than tried the oil (waffle) ring by itself and it slid into the cylinder no problem. Then I tried bottom + oil ring and could not get them to slide in.

I felt like I tired everything except the bench technique.

[madmaxter39]

Is it an OEM piston and rings or aftermarket, like a wiseco? Did you check your ring gap like the manual says?

Good Luck 👍

[Rrage523]

Its a wiseco kit. I haven't checked the gap but will have to after work tonight. You just check the two rings not the oil ring retainers?

One of the rings has a slight bevel, that is the top ring, and the ring without a bevel is second ring?

Thats how the oem looks and the directions read.

[meyer1son]

Just do it on the bench, it will work!

[TonyR]

Its getting hung up on the oil rings. I'm pretty confident I have them all in the slot on the piston with the gaps in the correct spots and the wavy (middle ring) not overlapped at all but it seems like I can't compress them enough to slide into the cylinder.

It is quite likely the middle ring is overlapping itself. Sometimes even after making sure the ends are matched together in the groove, it will move out a little when placing the other ring, and then overlap slightly when compressing, which is not obvious unless you look closely.

[lucgallant]

I remember a while back seeing a post on here of someone having a hard time putting a wiseco piston in.... I'll search for it and if I find it I'll post back.

[lucgallant]

This is when it was... although the OP never came back..

https://thumpertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=792583&highlight=wiseco+cylinder+piston

[smileyman]

This is what happened to me very frustrating , take a good look at the middle oil ring i would bet it is overlapping itself.Take it apart and try again , it may over lap when you try to squeze it together to install the cylinder.

It is quite likely the middle ring is overlapping itself. Sometimes even after making sure the ends are matched together in the groove, it will move out a little when placing the other ring, and then overlap slightly when compressing, which is not obvious unless you look closely.

[Rrage523]

In that link they someone said just cut a couple of the waves off the oil ring and it should work no problem?

Also what do you think about using the old oil (wavy) ring but everything else new from the kit?

[XtremeDuners]

Its a wiseco kit. I haven't checked the gap but will have to after work tonight. You just check the two rings not the oil ring retainers?

One of the rings has a slight bevel, that is the top ring, and the ring without a bevel is second ring?

Thats how the oem looks and the directions read.

It was me, I had the same issue back in January with a Wiesco piston and nothing changes when you get too the work bench it's a pain, never could get it right and I ran the bike for 20 minutes (after I got it in) something was telling me it didn't feel right. I pulled the cylinder and sure thing, it didn't seat right and was scratching the bore, but I caught it in time and honed it out. In the end I switched it out and put in a CP piston without issues and have about 20 hours on that one now.

I know there's some long lasting Wiesco fans out there, but get rid of that thing and get a JE or CP.

[spdfrks]

The piston is not the problem. I installed about 100 Wisecos last year alone. Don't cut anything off of the rings or reuse the stock ring either.

Start over. Take a step back, deep breaths.....

Remove all of the rings from the piston. Re check the end gaps on all of the rings. If this check out, reinstall the rings on the piston. Be careful not to overlap the expander. If you still can't get them, you need a ring compressor.

[Rrage523]

What effects will I see if I do reuse only the wavy oil ring? I swapped them out and everything fit together nicely, I don't want to use the old one but it solved my problem real quickly.

[SUnruh]

maybe the wave expander is keyed to the oil wipers?

i've only run JE for the last.....heck i forget how many years now.

[TonyR]

I swapped them out and everything fit together nicely, I don't want to use the old one but it solved my problem real quickly.

So, it is the spacer (wavy ring) thats catching. It could be slightly bent from being out of line when you initially tried to put the piston in, but probably not.

It is probably just the fact it is new, and more likely to spring and catch than the old worn one which will compress in and stay in line more easily.

I would focus on just trying to compress the two oil scraper rings and wavy spacer on their own, without the compression rings, or trying to put it in the cylinder, to see if you can get them to compress in totally first.

Make sure the ends of the wavy ring are butted together.

You have the right approach, by stopping and asking instead of forcing.

[XtremeDuners]

The piston is not the problem. I installed about 100 Wisecos last year alone. Don't cut anything off of the rings or reuse the stock ring either.

Start over. Take a step back, deep breaths.....

Remove all of the rings from the piston. Re check the end gaps on all of the rings. If this check out, reinstall the rings on the piston. Be careful not to overlap the expander. If you still can't get them, you need a ring compressor.

I've had more than one person have the same issue with Wiesco piston installs. I've installed many pistons as well, but decided to use Wiesco this time and regret it. Never had any of these issues with other brands.

For me it's piece of mind knowing I'm not going to blow a $1500 top end cuz the oil rings specs are crazy tight.

Just my $.02:thumbsup: