Stock shim stack configuration for '08 or '09 KTM 300 XC-W?

[Yardstick]

Does anyone know what the stock shim stacks consist of in the forks and shock for a 2008 or 2009 KTM 300 XC-W? I just got a 2008 used that was revalved front and rear at some point and it REALLY doesn't work for me. It's so far off that I just want to put it back to stock and try that out. I have the tools, just need the info! ?

[mog]

i have a 09 250 exc maybe of some use?

it came from TT with comments

The stock setting is

COMP std changes New fork works ok

24x0.10 (6) *add 1*

23x0.10 but for serious racers is soft and fast on rebound.

22x0.10

20x0.10

18x0.10

16x0.10

14x0.10

12x0.10

9.5x0.30 *10x0.30*

16x0.25

MID std

18x0.10(2) bleed * remove 1*

20x0.10(3) * add 1*

18x0.10

16x0.10

11x0.20

REb

20x0.10 (3 triang)

12x0.10

16x0.15

14x0.15

12x0.15 *add one 13x0.15*

10x0.30

14x0.25

Spring 4.2 * spring 4.4 rider weight 81 without gear*

oil level 110mm

Any recomentation for this?? Thank you, robben

[claytonwang]

Does anybody know if the stock shim stack arrangement was changed from 2007? I'm in the same boat (bought a bike where the previous owner messed with the valves) and now I'm trying to get it back to stock before making my own adjustments. I own a 2007 KTM 300 XC with the 4860 open chamber fork.

[adam728]

Try here
http://mobil.ktmshop.se

You can look up year/model and fork / shock settings. Extremely informative, stacks, spring rates, part numbers of all components, etc.

[claytonwang]

Thank you, adam728. That was extremely helpful. It only had shim stack information for the 2007 EXC. Think it's likely the same for the XC of that year?

All the EXC info was identical what is currently in the bike, except for the BV compression shims, which are quite different.

Let me know if I should start a whole new post with this. The forks on my 2007 300 XC is super harsh on blunt/fast hits. Front tire also tends to deflect a lot. Trying to make it a bit more plush.

What is currently in the bike:

BV (modified by previous owner? see stock settings below from 2007 300 EXC. same as XC?)

24 x 0.2

24 x 0.1

12 x 0.1

24 x 0.1

22 x 0.1

20 x 0.1

18 x 0.1

16 x 0.1

14 x 0.1

12 x 0.1

18 x 0.2

 

MID (current stack is stock)

24 x 0.1   (4)

22 x 0.1

20 x 0.1

18 x 0.1

11 x 0.4

11 x 0.35

11 x 0.15

 

REB (current stack is stock)

24 x 0.1 (4) delta

12 x 0.1

20 x 0.1

18 x 0.1

16 x 0.1

8.5 x 0.3  (2)

16 x 0.25

STOCK BV STACK FOR 2007 300 EXC:

24 x 0.1 (2)

14 x 0.1

24 x 0.1 (7)

22 x 0.1 (2)

20 x 0.1

18 x 0.1

16 x 0.1

14 x 0.1

8.5 x 0.3

18 x 0.25

 

THANK YOU

[mog]

You need to check if that's a 24.2 ,if it is it's super stiff

[claytonwang]

mog....good call. I measured it wrong the first time. It's a 24 x 0.1. With that in mind...any suggestions on changes I should make to soften high-speed hits? Thinking about just keeping the MID and REB the same so that I don't change too much at once. I'm a 170-lbs rider (without gear) who rides 95% technical trail. The current stack is:

BV

24 x 0.1 (2)

12 x 0.1

24 x 0.1

22 x 0.1

20 x 0.1

18 x 0.1

16 x 0.1

14 x 0.1

STOCK BV STACK FOR 2007 300 EXC. I'm not entirely sure if it's the same for the XC.

24 x 0.1 (2)

14 x 0.1

24 x 0.1 (7)

22 x 0.1 (2)

20 x 0.1

18 x 0.1

16 x 0.1

14 x 0.1

8.5 x 0.3

18 x 0.25

12 x 0.1

18 x 0.2

[mog]

It's been such a long time since I looked at a cc fork lol

I would look at the shim stack from.the 10 model ,I seem to remember they were pretty decent

The fork tube stiffness was changed in 09 for this very problem,you can only do so much with the pre 09 fork sorry to say

[claytonwang]

The model I have isn't the closed chamber. It's the 4860 open-chamber fork. Does that change anything?

Thank you for the heads-up on the '10 fork feeling better. I'll look into the stock shim stock for that year and work towards getting my stack closer to it. I wish I could just purchase the fork tube from an '09 or newer fork, but I assume that would also require all new internals. Looks like I get my '07 as dialed as possible and then go enjoy the ride!

I'm a bit confused as to why the stock '07 EXC stack has seven (yes, 7!) 24 x 0.1 shims in a spot where my current stack has a single 24 x 0.1 shim. That seems like a big difference! 

[mog]

The model I have isn't the closed chamber. It's the 4860 open-chamber fork. Does that change anything?
Thank you for the heads-up on the '10 fork feeling better. I'll look into the stock shim stock for that year and work towards getting my stack closer to it. I wish I could just purchase the fork tube from an '09 or newer fork, but I assume that would also require all new internals. Looks like I get my '07 as dialed as possible and then go enjoy the ride!
I'm a bit confused as to why the stock '07 EXC stack has seven (yes, 7!) 24 x 0.1 shims in a spot where my current stack has a single 24 x 0.1 shim. That seems like a big difference! 

One shim is way too few

Ah the oc fork ,not seen one of those apart for even longer lol

I would still look for the latest oc fork of your model and see what they did at WP , they tended to get better each year ( not a hard fact but close to )

[mog]

This is a 2008 250 xc fork

It's very different to yours

[claytonwang]

Woah...drastically different! Rebound stayed the same, but everything else is quite different. I'll change everything over to those settings and ride it for a bit. That'll hopefully create a better baseline to work from. Or best case scenario...it'll be spot-on! Thank you for all your help, mog.

I know folks always say this and rarely do, but I'll update this post with thoughts on the updated stack once shoulder surgery recovery allows me to ride in a few months. That way other folks with the '07 forks have a reference point.

[E-TECH]

2000 till 06 had 14mm rod and the big cart.    07/08 fork came with 12 mm rod and the old big cart. in 09 the dia. of cart. was reduced. this is a game changer.  the 07/08 mid NEEDS much support in the mid... it flowes SO much oil. also add a 14X.1 to the reb. side of mid.

for 07 the xc was valved very stiff.

07 and 08 and 09 rear are very different.

07 exc/xcw is old chassis the shock is shorter, takes more spring and valving.

09 was much better than 08 as the secondary piston and needle are way different ( better)

cannot compare valving.

Edited May 1, 2019 by E-TECH

[mog]

2000 till 06 had 14mm rod and the big cart.    07/08 fork came with 12 mm rod and the old big cart. in 09 the dia. of cart. was reduced. this is a game changer.  the 07/08 mid NEEDS much support in the mid... it flowes SO much oil. also add a 14X.1 to the reb. side of mid.
for 07 the xc was valved very stiff.
07 and 08 and 09 rear are very different.
07 exc/xcw is old chassis the shock is shorter, takes more spring and valving.
09 was much better than 08 as the secondary piston and needle are way different ( better)
cannot compare valving.

Thanks for adding that ,this is great info ,I don't remember the changes that came with the oc fork

[claytonwang]

55 minutes ago, E-TECH said:

2000 till 06 had 14mm rod and the big cart.    07/08 fork came with 12 mm rod and the old big cart. in 09 the dia. of cart. was reduced. this is a game changer.  the 07/08 mid NEEDS much support in the mid... it flowes SO much oil. also add a 14X.1 to the reb. side of mid.

for 07 the xc was valved very stiff.

07 and 08 and 09 rear are very different.

07 exc/xcw is old chassis the shock is shorter, takes more spring and valving.

09 was much better than 08 as the secondary piston and needle are way different ( better)

cannot compare valving.

Thank you for the info, E-TECH. Very helpful! I agree that the '07 is very stiff. I'm rattled after every ride on my '07 300 XC! I ordered all the shims yesterday to match the '08 250 XC valving. Is there a specific shim stack you suggest that is between what I have in my 300 and the stock '08 250 XC info that mog sent over? I was going to start with the following BV and MID, which is the '08 250 XC setup. Where do you suggest I add the 14 x 0.1? Sorry to have so many questions. I'm learning a lot!

BV

24 x 0.1  (2)

14 x 0.1

24 x 0.1  (6)

22 x 0.1  (2)

20 x 0.1

18 x 0.1

16 x 0.1

14 x 0.1

9 x 0.3

18 x 0.25

MID

24 x 0.1  (4)

20 x 0.1

11 x 0.1  (3)

REB (identical to what is currently in my bike)

24 x 0.1 (4) delta

12 x 0.1

20 x 0.1

18 x 0.1

16 x 0.1

8.5 x 0.3  (2)

16 x 0.25

[E-TECH]

 Well in the US our 08 XC came with the closed chamber fork, is that what you got in Europe ???

 I really beat my head against the wall with the 0708 fork, I could give you what I did to the mid valve but you probably would not believe it ?

[claytonwang]

13 minutes ago, E-TECH said:

 Well in the US our 08 XC came with the closed chamber fork, is that what you got in Europe ???

 I really beat my head against the wall with the 0708 fork, I could give you what I did to the mid valve but you probably would not believe it ?

I'm in the US as well. Good ole Bellingham, Washington!

Ahhhh so if I use those '08 250 XC shim stack settings, then I'm using a valve setup optimized for a closed chamber fork even though I have an open chamber 4860 on my '07 300 XC. I'd be very grateful to see what stack you ended up going with. With how incredibly stiff and wonky the fork feels now, I believe that only a wonky stack could fix it haha. 

[claytonwang]

Alright folks...I did something dumb. Today I finally got around to swapping out the shim stack and getting everything back together. But...the 24 x 0.4 check valve was hung up on a ledge when I tightened it down and it mushroomed the inner opening quite a bit. I can't find the 24 x 0.4 check valve anywhere, even online. Can I simply stack four of the 24 x 0.1 shims in its place or is there a reason why it's one solid 0.4mm shim? Seems to me that it would have the exact same effect. Thank you.

[mog]

I think you could