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California OHV artical in USA today

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http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2010-04-05-atv-parks_N.htm?csp=usat.me

By Laura Bruno, USA TODAY

The dustup between all-terrain vehicle enthusiasts and land conservationists is intensifying this year as more people go in search of places to ride and more groups race to protect large portions of public lands.

Three bills currently under consideration by Congress would grant wilderness protection to more than 34 million acres of land, and 13 million acres in 11 states are under consideration for new National Monument designation, says Department of Interior spokeswoman Kendra Barkoff.

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If those proposals become law, motorized vehicles would be barred from lands in Alaska, Arizona, California, Colorado, Montana, Nevada, New Mexico, Oregon, Utah, Washington and Wyoming.

"Any closure is bad because it leads to more and more closures," says Jack Hickman, president of the Arizona Off-Highway Vehicle Coalition. "With more people buying vehicles and less land to recreate on it means more damage to the land."

The number of off-road vehicles grew 230% from 3 million in 1993 to 10 million vehicles in 2008, according to a U.S. Forest Service estimate.

Sites across the country previously open to off-road vehicles have been closed in recent years because heavy use or abuse tore up soil and plants or eroded roads leading to silt buildups in nearby waters. They include:

• About 55,000 acres of land in Arizona's Sonoran Desert National Monument were closed to motorized vehicles in 2008 to rehabilitate the natural landscape. Those lands will remain closed indefinitely while a land-use plan is completed, according to the Bureau of Land Management's Phoenix district office.

• The 16-mile Patterson Mountain ATV Trail System in Virginia was closed this year when the Forest Service found the poor condition of trails was hurting water quality in adjacent streams. The area is closed indefinitely, the Forest Service says.

• The 39-mile Upper Tellico Off-Highway Vehicle Trail System in North Carolina was closed permanently in 2009 because visible sediment from the trails was reaching the Tellico River, according to the Forest Service.

"This is exacerbated by ATV and off-road sales going up and up and up," says Ed Moreland of the American Motorcyclist Association.

While wide swaths of public land are open to ATVs — 33,000 miles of trails managed by the Forest Service and 206.3 million acres by the federal Bureau of Land Management — there are concerns that reckless riders continue to damage land, Moreland says.

Brad Powell, a former regional forester for the Forest Service who now works for Trout Unlimited, says concerns about land damage are legitimate and the explosion in off-vehicle use requires a re-evaluation of where it's appropriate to ride.

"They are far from running out of spots to ride," Powell says of off-road vehicle users. "I'm not opposed to OHV use, I want to find the appropriate balance that's been lost with the explosion of growth in vehicles."

Riders care about the land, too, Hickman says, using their vehicles to appreciate sites they could not reach on foot. While some lands should remain wilderness, others with existing roadways should not be taken away, he says.

A proposal for an ATV park in Florida's Everglades has local environmentalists upset. Miami-Dade County has proposed an ATV park in the Big Cypress National Preserve, which the Broward Group of the Sierra Club has opposed.

"To think of this place as a playground for recreational vehicles is not giving this special piece of land the respect and concern required," says Matthew Schwartz of the Broward Sierra Club.

One potential victory for ATV riders is in the works in New Jersey, where there are no public lands currently open to off-road vehicles.

A law passed in January requires the state to find a public site for riders in order for the state to collect registration fees and penalty fees for illegal riding.

A public site is long overdue for the riders of an estimated 250,000 vehicles in the state, said Dale Freitas, president of the New Jersey Off-Highway Vehicle Association.

"The vast majority want to do things responsibly, but the only way to correct the problem is with facilities where people can come and take safety training courses," Freitas says. "Make it a quality site and people will want to come back."

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What I find amazing is the fact while riding the desert, I never see anyone out there other than other OHV'ers, prospectors, shooters, etc. The greenies want to "protect" the enviroment for the enjoyment of all. Then where the hell are they?

Couple of weeks ago we did almost 250 miles of riding, we passed two 4X4's and a small group by Cuddeback. Where are all these people on foot exploring the natural wonders? Or is a greenie in a vehicle exempt from the rules they preach?

The irony and stupidity of the "movement" never ceases to amaze me.

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Well look at it like this Agent2--why would non-riders want to hike in a OHV area? The greenies are in the wilderness areas or in the areas not frequented by riders. Make sense? Try considering all options before being amazed at ironies and stupidities that may not actually apply.

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What I find amazing is the fact while riding the desert, I never see anyone out there other than other OHV'ers, prospectors, shooters, etc. The greenies want to "protect" the enviroment for the enjoyment of all. Then where the hell are they?

Couple of weeks ago we did almost 250 miles of riding, we passed two 4X4's and a small group by Cuddeback. Where are all these people on foot exploring the natural wonders? Or is a greenie in a vehicle exempt from the rules they preach?

The irony and stupidity of the "movement" never ceases to amaze me.

Very well put and could not have said it better 👍

🤣 what happened to "Land of the Free" ?

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Well look at it like this Agent2--why would non-riders want to hike in a OHV area? The greenies are in the wilderness areas or in the areas not frequented by riders. Make sense? Try considering all options before being amazed at ironies and stupidities that may not actually apply.

So Dezertman being a Newbie introduce yourself by telling us what you ride, where you ride, and how long you've been riding?

Having been one of the lucky ones that was out in beautiful JV this past weekend, I too am amazed there was no one other than a "select few" that were out enjoying themselves. I think it is a bunch of B.S. to assume it's because of the OHV traffic that they don't frequent the area or areas!

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Well look at it like this Agent2--why would non-riders want to hike in a OHV area? The greenies are in the wilderness areas or in the areas not frequented by riders. Make sense? Try considering all options before being amazed at ironies and stupidities that may not actually apply.

Who has more area open to their use?

The OHVer or the non-OHVer?

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Closures are not happening only because of resource damage (silty water).

Most closures in the National Forests are happening because they do not have money to maintain (at least that is what they are telling us) not because of resource damage.

Now I know you will go and say without maintenance resource damage will follow. That is not always the case. Without maintenance (by FS workers) the trail will either grow back to natural state or will be maintained by users (with very little resource damage). Or at least that is the case with most the singletrack that is now closed due to no money to maintain.

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He is an anti OHV troll and has been banned!

So Dezertman being a Newbie introduce yourself by telling us what you ride, where you ride, and how long you've been riding?

Having been one of the lucky ones that was out in beautiful JV this past weekend, I too am amazed there was no one other than a "select few" that were out enjoying themselves. I think it is a bunch of B.S. to assume it's because of the OHV traffic that they don't frequent the area or areas!

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wow. Did he get banned just for that?? or does he have other posts I haven't seen?

TT isn't the place for greenie-vs-rider debates; those kind of things just turn into wastes of time (worse than the pro/anti BRC thread!!) but his adding a simple observation doesn't seem disruptive to me. It doesn't help us to enforce ideological purity here - it's helpful to see how "the other side" might react to some of our points of view. And from what he said I can't tell if he rides or not.

Like it or not, the OHV community (and I'm prejudiced, I mean the dirt-bike community) needs to find ways to communicate with our opponents - or even more importantly, people who don't care much either way - and people who can talk about both side's points of view are valuable.

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I think education is key to keeping our areas open. The explosion of OHV's in CA has led to way too many rookies out there with no common sense or simple courtesy... most of these idiots seem to be on quads. I would be willing to pay more for my red/green sticker fees if I knew the money was going to keeping the riding areas open and a bit for education (they should charge quads twice as much because they have 4 wheels... and just because I hate quads)

I live in So Cal, but went up to the Bay Area to visit family for Easter. On the way up, we stopped at Hollister for a little half day ride on Friday.. The place was packed!! I have never seen so many people there and at 10:30 am on Friday, they weren't letting in any more RV's (no room). This is the impact of land closure (Clear Creek). I also got a full day ride of billie goating at Carnegie on Saturday and I am so glad they re-opened and i hope it stays open in the future. They have made a lot of changes to the creek area of the park since the issues earier this year and I hope that helps the cause...

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it's helpful to see how "the other side" might react to some of our points of view.

I agree, Lets let this guy show his hand before banning him. I recently

got banned off a site that had healthy debate pro/anti OHV.

And there was not even any debate, I just got caught up in house cleaning

Site in question is now very stagnant

Wayne

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Like they always say, attack the debate, not the debater. (oh here we go with the master jokes)

dezertman=done, his registered e-mail must have come up on a blacklist.

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and just to be clear, I'm really not at all interested in having debates pro/vs off-road on this site. We're all off-road enthusiasts, or at least people curious about how off-roaders think. But I don't need the second group to tell us why we're wrong. I do like hearing about weaknesses in our positions, and why we don't come across sympathetically when the media writes about us. Anything to help us make our public message more effective is great. We need the average non-rider to agree when we feel like someone's unfairly closing riding areas.

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You would think with all this popularity of OHV riding it would translate into MORE riding areas. Do OHVers not vote? Politicians listen to hand written letters. I guess OHVers can't take the time to scribble a small note to those who hold the power over the riding areas.👍

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I think education is key to keeping our areas open. The explosion of OHV's in CA has led to way too many rookies out there with no common sense or simple courtesy... most of these idiots seem to be on quads. I would be willing to pay more for my red/green sticker fees if I knew the money was going to keeping the riding areas open and a bit for education (they should charge quads twice as much because they have 4 wheels... and just because I hate quads)

I live in So Cal, but went up to the Bay Area to visit family for Easter. On the way up, we stopped at Hollister for a little half day ride on Friday.. The place was packed!! I have never seen so many people there and at 10:30 am on Friday, they weren't letting in any more RV's (no room). This is the impact of land closure (Clear Creek). I also got a full day ride of billie goating at Carnegie on Saturday and I am so glad they re-opened and i hope it stays open in the future. They have made a lot of changes to the creek area of the park since the issues earier this year and I hope that helps the cause...

I agree with this quote but atleast they ride where they are supposed to. This is just my opinion and not meant to pee in anyones wheaties but from what I have notice it is the animals on two wheels are the ones who cut down fences and ride where thier not supposed to and that hurts this sport even more. Once again this is just something that I have noticed over the years and agree education is the key to this.

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I agree with this quote but atleast they ride where they are supposed to. This is just my opinion and not meant to pee in anyones wheaties but from what I have notice it is the animals on two wheels are the ones who cut down fences and ride where thier not supposed to and that hurts this sport even more. Once again this is just something that I have noticed over the years and agree education is the key to this.

...riiightt 👍🤣:lol:

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I agree with this quote but atleast they ride where they are supposed to. This is just my opinion and not meant to pee in anyones wheaties but from what I have notice it is the animals on two wheels are the ones who cut down fences and ride where thier not supposed to and that hurts this sport even more. Once again this is just something that I have noticed over the years and agree education is the key to this.

Lame post!

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I been riding 43 years and I also used to hike alot. I would not hike where I could ride. The wilderness is for the hiker and that's where you`ll find them, not out on some chewed up course. You might run into some in the forest but the desert is for the peak baggers.

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