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Tranny oil is STILL grey.


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Craaaaaaaaaap. What does this mean? I'm using non energy conserving oil. I have absolutely no money right now, and my clutch feels like it's working fine. I got slack in my cable, so it's not like it's slipping that way. It does do the little jump when you put it in first when you are holding the clutch lever in, but I thought that was just the basket. What do I do about this???

EDIT: Is the grey color in the oil metal? If it is, I'm assuming it would be a really bad idea to run with a bad clutch? Also, could I just replace the disks and not the basket, or will my bad basket contribute to faster wear of the plates?

Thanks,

Alex

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Craaaaaaaaaap. What does this mean? I'm using non energy conserving oil. I have absolutely no money right now, and my clutch feels like it's working fine. I got slack in my cable, so it's not like it's slipping that way. It does do the little jump when you put it in first when you are holding the clutch lever in, but I thought that was just the basket. What do I do about this???

EDIT: Is the grey color in the oil metal? If it is, I'm assuming it would be a really bad idea to run with a bad clutch? Also, could I just replace the disks and not the basket, or will my bad basket contribute to faster wear of the plates?

Thanks,

Alex

I rode mine for some time like this. Even a lot of single track where i was slipping my clutch a lot and it worked fine. It will eventually slip, or like mine stop engaugeing alltogether.

Don`t get in a big hurry, all you`ll need is plates. $50 steel plates from rockytmountain is a much better bargain than $150 aluminum plates.

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Not many hours. I just spent my last bit of cash on an hour meter yesterday. I'm assuming 3-5 hours were in that batch of oil though. The engine oil wasn't even black though. It was more of a dark dark gold. Still see through, but obviously not completely used. The tranny oil was straight up grey. I'll have to make a video of me emptying the oil and show it to you guys so you can diagnose. It's probably the clutch I suppose though.

And you say I'll be fine without a basket? Like I said, the bike jumps forward a bit when I switch to first from neutral. That's a sign of a grooved clutch basket. I'm just worried that a worn basket will expedite the wear on the plates.

Thanks,

Alex

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Just pull your plates out now and take a look at your basket to see how groved it is. That will cost nothing, you can reuse the gasket on the clutch cover. Don`t worry if it`s a little groved.

Mmk, I'll take a picture and put it on here. Also, how important is the torque specs for the pressure plate?

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What grooves should I be looking at? And how much is a OEM basket? Like $60-$70? And I've got a pic of the pressure plate up, and it looks fine, but then again, I thought the basket looked fine. Lol. How much will this cost me total, and is it safe to be riding with this stuff broken until I save up the cash for a new clutch?

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The grooves are made by the clutch plates banging into the clutch basket every time the clutch is engaged. The clutch basket is about $240 bucks. The inner clutch hub that the pressure plate connects to is about $80. Here is a link to a diagram for an 04, i forget what year your bike was.

http://www.motosport.com/dirtbike/oem-parts/HONDA/2004/CRF450R/?modelyearid=77&typeid=1&groupId=3060

You can see the grooves in this picture the best.

clutchbasket.jpg

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Sorry home slice. You need a new basket at minimum. Those grooves are too deep to be filed down. I would also recommend replacing the inner clutch hub as well. What kind of shape is the pressure plate in?

lmao dont listen to this guy. hes gonna end up costing you thousands of dollars that dont need to be spent. some people just have more money than brains I tell ya.

your basket IS grooved... not a big deal, ive seen WAY deeper grooved than that, 2-3x deeper, they got filed out and the bike ran fine for a whole summer! your grooves are only 1/16th of an inch... I doubt the plates are even getting hung up on the basket yet. yes its safe to ride... worse that will happen is you need to turn the cable adjusting screw on your bike in order to get the clutch to not walk forward a little bit.. the clutch plates failing you is more of a concern than a bad basket IMO... if the plates are fried than your bike wont even move when in gear, that sucks, but your plates look fine.

your clutch plates look good so I wouldnt touch those, but the basket definitely needs a filing, take the basket out and file down those notches with a hand file until theyre flat again. some people say this increases the area in which the clutch plate can rattle (which is true), they say it will rattle more (which is true) and it will hit that basket even harder (which is true) and cause it to wear down WWWAAYYY faster (which is NOT true), it will wear down faster than normal, but I can assure/promise/guarantee you that if you filed down your basket, you could get another 50+ engine hours from it. ive done it twice, and two friends have done it. and our grooves were WAY deeper, and our bikes had WAY more power than yours. (crf450 with every mod + cr500 bored over 2mm, 22cc over making it to a cr513)

the inner clutch hub... IMO dont even worry about it. mine was in worse condition with 150 hours on it... I still used it, have had about 40 hours so far and not one single tiny problem yet.

a new basket and clutch plates just cost me 450$ last summer (barnett basket + barnett carbon fibre plates).

some people follow the manual religiously and have a 10,000$, 400 lb, knee deep pile of used engine parts in their shop that aernt even worn out yet. dont be one of those people ๐Ÿ™‚

you can either 1: use 0 brain cells and just order all new everything. 0 stress on your brain but hurts the wallet

OR

2. use your brain/tt/google/youtube/service manual and fix everything so its like new again. some stress on the brain and body but 0 stress on the wallet + you fell good/proud/accomplished when you fix/repair parts successfully+ you learn something which cant have a price tag placed on it!

file that basket, put it together and ride, dont worry about the color of the oil. if your bike starts acting/riding weird then you should be concerned, but until then, dont fix/replace/take apart what aint broke. my oil comes out grey too and I have a brand new clutch, I dont worry about it. a lot also has to do with water... I think people here are kinda scaring and confusing you.

oil + water does not equal "milk" yes it looks like milk, but its not THAT perfectly white.. its grey and NON sparkly.

oil + metal equals grey oil but its a different kind of grey than water, also it will be shiney and you will see metal dust floating around, nothing too too serious but something you might wanna keep an eye on. no big deal.

Edited by yz144builderlol
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lmao dont listen to this guy. hes gonna end up costing you thousands of dollars that dont need to be spent. some people just have more money than brains I tell ya.

your basket IS grooved... not a big deal, ive seen WAY deeper grooved than that, 2-3x deeper, they got filed out and the bike ran fine for a whole summer! yes its safe to ride... worse that will happen is you need to turn the screw on your bike in order to get the clutch to not walk forward.. the clutch plates failing you is more of a concern than a bad basket IMO... if the plates are fried than your bike wont even move when in gear, that sucks but your plates look fine.

your clutch plates look good so I wouldnt touch those, but the basket definitely needs a filing, take the basket out and file down those notches with a hand file until theyre flat again. some people say this increases the area in which the clutch plate can rattle (which is true), they say it will rattle more (which is true) and it will hit that basket even harder (which is true) and cause it to wear down WWWAAYYY faster (which is NOT true), it will wear down faster than normal, but I can assure/promise/guarantee you that if you filed down your basket, you could get another 50+ engine hours from it. ive done it twice, and two friends have done it. and our grooves were WAY deeper, and our bikes had WAY more power than yours. (crf450 with every mod + cr500 bored over 2mm, 22cc over making it to a cr513)

the inner clutch hub... IMO dont even worry about it. mine was in worse condition with 150 hours on it... I still used it, have had about 40 hours so far and not one single tiny problem yet.

a new basket and clutch plates just cost me 450$ last summer (barnett basket + barnett carbon fibre plates).

some people follow the manual religiously and have a 10,000$, 400 lb, knee deep pile of used engine parts in their shop that aernt even worn out yet. dont be one of those people ๐Ÿ™‚

you can either 1: use 0 brain cells and just order all new everything. 0 stress on your brain but hurts the wallet

OR

2. use your brain/tt/google/youtube/service manual and fix everything so its like new again. some stress on the brain and body but 0 stress on the wallet + you fell good/proud/accomplished when you fix/repair parts successfully+ you learn something which cant have a price tag placed on it!

file that basket, put it together and ride, dont worry about the color of the oil. if your bike starts acting/riding weird then you should be concerned, but until then, dont fix/replace/take apart what aint broke. my oil comes out grey too and I have a brand new clutch, I dont worry about it. a lot also has to do with water... I think people here are kinda scaring and confusing you.

oil + water does not equal "milk" yes it looks like milk, but its not THAT perfectly white.. its grey and NON sparkly.

oil + metal equals grey oil but its a different kind of grey than water, also it will be shiney and you will see metal dust floating around, nothing too too serious but something you might wanna keep an eye on. no big deal.

And what happens once the structural integrity of the metal is degraded to a point where it takes of a finger on the basket case? Now he has a good chunk of metal going around in there that can do more than $240 bucks in damage. I'd say get a Wiseco basket since the come with a warranty against that type of damage and you should replace your inner hub bit the grooving is a little less so it would live.

Been there done that by listening to this kinda crap advice. It also doesnt matter what mods you guys do to your bikes if youre not even riding it hard.

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And what happens once the structural integrity of the metal is degraded to a point where it takes of a finger on the basket case? Now he has a good chunk of metal going around in there that can do more than $240 bucks in damage. I'd say get a Wiseco basket since the come with a warranty against that type of damage and you should replace your inner hub bit the grooving is a little less so it would live.

Been there done that by listening to this kinda crap advice. It also doesnt matter what mods you guys do to your bikes if youre not even riding it hard.

if were not riding the bikes hard, why would we want them with 25% more power than they come stock?!? ๐Ÿ™‚:bonk: we got some hill climbs here in the mountains that makes my buddies yz450f thats bored 3mm and stroked 4mm into like a yz 520f blush. stock bikes around here are for beginners... if you wanna make it to the top of a mountain and hang out with the big boys on a mountain top, then you better get some more power otherwise wait for us at the bottom!!! and no one likes waiting at the bottom with their weak bike while all the screamers are up at the top already! so yeah, I think we use the extra power that weve added to them. some could still use more!

I dont think were going to have to worry about any metal structural degradation on that clutch basket by filing down 1/8th of an inch of metal... under 10% of its original thickness. this is a pump gas powered engine not a 8000 HP nitromethane powered funny car. I could understand if the forces were coming at it from top/bottom.. but theyre not, theyre coming at it from the side, I will give you my left nut if you can break one of those filed down fingers off a clutch basket by exerting side force on it, there might be that 1 in a billion weak basket, but ill take my odds.

like I said, if a 75+ HP cr500 can handle a basket for 2 summers thats had 1/4 inch grooves filed down than I think picos will be fine until he can come up with some cash for a new one.

if you got 250$ burning a hole in your pocket, then go ahead and buy a new basket. but if you wanna take those "crazy" odds of failure, than give it a file and see how you like it, costs nothing but time!!

ps: if you think that basket is toast and are gonna throw it away, give it to me. ill pay shipping, file it down myself, and keep it as a nice spare, not that id ever need it.

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Your basket and inner hub need to be replaced. Plain and simple. If you file the grooves out you increase the space between the fingers thus allow more play in the plates which in turn increases your risk of breaking them.

Your pics show a lot of sludge in the motor. use some quality oil. Dont cheap out on the lubricants. You can pay now or later basically. I have always used the Honda HP tranny oil, never any issues.

YOu may also have some oil migration issues for the engine side. Have you checked your engine oil level after riding? if it decreases and the tranny increases, you need a new right crank seal, balancer seal and bearings and right side case gasket and water pump dowel Oring.

Your steels look fine, the frictions contaminated.

if you want a great clutch setup on a budget here is what you do:

Ebay: Find a PE or Magnum billet clutch basket

Rockymoutainmc.com: Tusk clutch kit minus springs and ProX inner hub

Honda OEM: right clutch case gasket, new OEM clutch springs, water pump down Oring and a few bottles of Honda HP tranny fluid. Should be under $300 total there but you get a new clutch, billet basket and new inner.

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Your basket and inner hub need to be replaced. Plain and simple. If you file the grooves out you increase the space between the fingers thus allow more play in the plates which in turn increases your risk of breaking them.

Your pics show a lot of sludge in the motor. use some quality oil. Dont cheap out on the lubricants. You can pay now or later basically. I have always used the Honda HP tranny oil, never any issues.

YOu may also have some oil migration issues for the engine side. Have you checked your engine oil level after riding? if it decreases and the tranny increases, you need a new right crank seal, balancer seal and bearings and right side case gasket and water pump dowel Oring.

Your steels look fine, the frictions contaminated.

if you want a great clutch setup on a budget here is what you do:

Ebay: Find a PE or Magnum billet clutch basket

Rockymoutainmc.com: Tusk clutch kit minus springs and ProX inner hub

Honda OEM: right clutch case gasket, new OEM clutch springs, water pump down Oring and a few bottles of Honda HP tranny fluid. Should be under $300 total there but you get a new clutch, billet basket and new inner.

I don't know about it going into the tranny, but I definitely notice the engine oil level going down after the first ride after an oil change. I thought it was just being distributed around. It seems though, that after I fill it up to the H line, that it stays that was from then on. It's just the first ride after the oil change that it goes down.

Where is sludge in the motor? Which picture should I look at and look for what, because I can't see anything.

$300 are you kidding me??? Nooooo!!! ๐Ÿ™‚:foul::banana::foul:๐Ÿคฃ

Can I at least ride while I get the money? Is it gonna hurt anything? I'm not thinking of filing anything down, but if I just leave it, can I use it till I get the cash, which admittedly probably won't be till like over winter. Takes me a while to get money, and I get most of it from good grades, and school year starts in august.

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I don't know about it going into the tranny, but I definitely notice the engine oil level going down after the first ride after an oil change. I thought it was just being distributed around. It seems though, that after I fill it up to the H line, that it stays that was from then on. It's just the first ride after the oil change that it goes down.

Where is sludge in the motor? Which picture should I look at and look for what, because I can't see anything.

$300 are you kidding me??? Nooooo!!! ๐Ÿ™‚:foul::banana::foul:๐Ÿคฃ

Can I at least ride while I get the money? Is it gonna hurt anything? I'm not thinking of filing anything down, but if I just leave it, can I use it till I get the cash, which admittedly probably won't be till like over winter. Takes me a while to get money, and I get most of it from good grades, and school year starts in august.

Im not sure about Hondas since Im yet to have to tear the bottom ends upon on mine but the for the clutch on my Yamaha its hydraulic once it goes into the cases, those groves will let the friction plates get trapped in them for a bit which would put more pressure on the hydraulic system. This puts more pressures on the seals and and other parts leading to premature failure and the only way to get to some of them is by splitting the cases.

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