Switchbacks: how to

[gonnagetaktm]

I ride up in the mountains and there are trails where the switchbacks are so sharp all I can do is get off the bike and do a 5 to 7 point turn. And going up or down no way seems easier. Am I overlooking something or is there an easier way?

[2strokezuke]

Well, the only maunover I know of is to lock up the back and skid around. This can be hard if the bike is tall and heavy, the rider is small or heavy, or inexperienced. It takes practice and is possible to do regardless of the bike or body build. Knoby tires slide very predictivly when locked up.

Another way I have heard of is to lock up the front, doing an endo, and swing the back around. Never treid it though.

Tony

[gonnagetaktm]

Well at this place it's soo steep that when you lock up the back it just slides down the hill the opposite of the way you need to turn

[mylsmkj]

The basic thing to do is start outside and cut to the inside apex of the turn, then to the outside again. When brake sliding start your turn with the standard above then lock the rear up (have to be aggressive here) you want your previous momentum to carry the rear the same direction it was after the front has begun the turn. On tight stuff I usually brakeslide going down hill, if your rear falls to the inside you can make it fall before the inside apex and that will give you more traction to roll the front around your not moving as fast rear tire.

Uphill you can roost the corner or on really tight ones plant your inside foot on the inside apex gas to loft the front and pull it around and keep going. Uphill is easier for me, I'm sure just because it's easier to be aggressive.

One thing to keep in mind these things I've said are hard on the land and we all might be better off just manhandling our bikes in some places to keep them open.

Edited August 4, 2010 by mylsmkj

[trailrider95]

http://www.dirtrider.com/riding_tips/pro_secrets/141_1004_switchback_turns_with_jcr_honda_quinn_cody/index.html

I thought it was somewhat helpful. Pretty good short video.

[Behind Bars]

I ride alot of mountain trails. Mostly, I am able to slide the rear into about the first 1/4 or 1/3 of the turn, then complete the turn. This works going up and down. It is easier for me on left turns b/c I can use the rear brake better in the turn.

When they are too tight/steep for this maneuver, I will resort to my other technique. I will ride up the bank on the outside, uphill side of the turn, as close to the apex as necessary--then back down, rear wheel towards the outside of the turn, effectively changing direction of the bike. I'm not sure if this description is sufficient. Here's an example: tonight I was going downhill and overshot a switchback to the right. I ended up stopped maybe a foot or two too far past the apex to make the turn, so I turned all the way left and rode up the embankment on the uphill side of the turn until my bike was maybe 40 deg uphill, then backed back down to my right so that I was facing back the way I came. With a slight left turn from there I was on the downhill side of the switchback. This technique is much better for uphill turns b/c when you come through the turn you are already facing the embankment.

The last technique I've used is wheelying the bike and turning it in the correct direction. This is faster and harder than what I just described, but it is necessary if there is a cliff on the uphill side.

I've never seen or heard of someone trying to do an endo into the corner. I would pay to see someone try this on a tight mountain trail.

[mylsmkj]

I've never seen or heard of someone trying to do an endo into the corner. I would pay to see someone try this on a tight mountain trail.

It's a trials technique, I've never done it but there are folks who can do it very effectively with any enduro bike made.

[mylsmkj]

I just did a google search and this was the first thng that came up. It's a sweet vid! Not much for what I was trying to say but you can see a number of times they use that technique to reposition the rear wheel, not as much as in real life but this is a highlight video.

[Cold Smoke]

I just did a google search and this was the first thng that came up. It's a sweet vid! Not much for what I was trying to say but you can see a number of times they use that technique to reposition the rear wheel, not as much as in real life but this is a highlight video.

No sweat! I'll be all over those moves next time I'm out. Will post video when I'm released from the hospital.

I've had good luck on uphill switchbacks when you can get your front tire on the uphill bank as mikea 2 said. Even if you can't wheelie it you can pop your tire off the bank and bring the front end around

[Behind Bars]

I just did a google search and this was the first thng that came up. It's a sweet vid! Not much for what I was trying to say but you can see a number of times they use that technique to reposition the rear wheel, not as much as in real life but this is a highlight video.

I enjoyed the video, love trials stuff. But you realize that you posted a highlight reel from a trials champion in a thread trying to explain how to handle switchbacks? Most mnt switchbacks I encounter are steep and loose, and if you tried to lock up your front end to swing the rear around, you WILL be on the ground. Closest thing you can do is to get off the bike on the inside of the turn, lock up your front tire, and lift the rear to the outside of the turn. I don't like getting off my bike, but if I do it is probably to do this maneuver. In short, my position on the endo stands: I will pay to see someone try it in a mnt switchback as described in the op. Heck, if you can pull it off I'd even throw in a 6 pack of pbr.

[llamaface]

Well at this place it's soo steep that when you lock up the back it just slides down the hill the opposite of the way you need to turn

yer doin it wrong. probably trying to skid the rear wheel before you are at the apex.

generally you barely need any sliding at all to get around most switchbacks. If you start outside, and then cut your front wheel right in towards the apex, most switchbacks have a slight berm on the inside at the apex, when the back wheel hits this berm, it will very gently slide just enough to get you around.

Of course, there's a wide variety of switchbacks. What some people calll 'switchbacks' are good places to pass, like the ones on chimney rock trail at downieville that are about 8' wide and easy. Others are pretty much unrideable by normal people. I'm not too proud to get off and drag the back wheel around slightly. It's less work than dragging the bike back up on the trail.

[gonnagetaktm]

So I'm riding along on a tight single track. Uphill on left is basically scraping the foot pegs and on the right is a straight drop off. As your going along all the sudden the trail dropped down next to you and you have no more room than the length of your biketo turn around and go straight back from where you came just up. With near virticle up on side and drop of on other. The only way I can do it is with some speed. Lock up back? But the front tire to the hill. Then get off and swing the back end around or a 5 point turn. Coming down is basically just don't lock up and go down cliff

[Behind Bars]

So I'm riding along on a tight single track. Uphill on left is basically scraping the foot pegs and on the right is a straight drop off. As your going along all the sudden the trail dropped down next to you and you have no more room than the length of your biketo turn around and go straight back from where you came just up. With near virticle up on side and drop of on other. The only way I can do it is with some speed. Lock up back? But the front tire to the hill. Then get off and swing the back end around or a 5 point turn. Coming down is basically just don't lock up and go down cliff

I'm having a hard time following. Are you turning to the right or left (uphill or downhill)? It sounds like you might be on really tight/steep switchbacks, which can be hard to go down. Sometimes I think you have to get off. Try some of the meathods listed. I've stood a bike on end and pivoted on very tight and steep spots, and I've gotten off and locked up the front brake and slid out the rear on similar switchbacks when going down. I think the sliding technique is only to be used on rideable switchbacks, and I'm not convinced at all that every switchback is rideable, though most I see are.

For me, doing those 5 point turns is way too tiring, that's why I've learned other techniques. However, at the end of the day, if it gets you up and down the trail then you could be doing alot worse. I know people who won't ride a trail with switchbacks.

Do you have any photos?

[IDtrucks]

So I'm riding along on a tight single track. Uphill on left is basically scraping the foot pegs and on the right is a straight drop off. As your going along all the sudden the trail dropped down next to you and you have no more room than the length of your biketo turn around and go straight back from where you came just up. With near virticle up on side and drop of on other. The only way I can do it is with some speed. Lock up back? But the front tire to the hill. Then get off and swing the back end around or a 5 point turn. Coming down is basically just don't lock up and go down cliff

if the track is THAT skinny i wouldnt even ride it haha. I like not destroying my bike thank you. I want to see some pics too!

[llamaface]

if the track is THAT skinny i wouldnt even ride it haha. I like not destroying my bike thank you. I want to see some pics too!

this one is in the idaho city area

further north.

[motovita]

I ride up in the mountains and there are trails where the switchbacks are so sharp all I can do is get off the bike and do a 5 to 7 point turn. And going up or down no way seems easier. Am I overlooking something or is there an easier way?

No offense intended here, but can you consistently make full lock turns on flat ground? Are your steering stops adjusted for maximum lock?

The better you can turn in your driveway, the better you can turn in the mountains. Practice, practice, practice.

There are of course many switchbacks, as above, that require dismounting and dragging for most of us.

[Behind Bars]

Those are cool photos, Llama. No way I'm staying on my bike for that switchback. You inspired me, so I dug through my very limited photos and found these. They are from a trail system just south of town that some liberal judge stole from the public when he single handedly shut down to all wheeled use, ruling that it bothered other users too much (never seen anybody but mnt bikes and motorcycles up there!).

There is a switchback on the face of the hill, kind of small in the pic:

This switchback is covered in a snow bank, had to slide the bikes down. If you look closely, you might be able to see the trail coming down from Hyalite peak:

[IDtrucks]

this one is in the idaho city area

further north.

WHAT! I didnt even see you were from idaho. Where in idaho city is that? Is there a trail name? I would have to be in a really ballsy mood to try that. Thats insane

[MrSmooth]

I've never seen or heard of someone trying to do an endo into the corner. I would pay to see someone try this on a tight mountain trail.

How much are you paying?

[Behind Bars]

How much are you paying?

Haha. I was waiting for that. Probably not enough to fund your trip up here for my viewing pleasure, but I would definately be able to outfit you to a night of drinks if you came up here to show your stuff. You might need the booze to help with the resulting bodily damage I think might ensue. Or I could be wrong...