08 vs 09 for offroad? is the 09 any good?

i'm after a 450 mxer for offroad, in my area theres quite a few 08 and 09 CRF450's for sale for good money, i know the 08's are a good thing, for mx, i'm looking to ride offroad and honestly EFI is appealing to me for the ease of starting after dropping the bike, and no flooding, but i hear the 09's had alot of problems, such as heavy clutch, poor gearbox reliability, leaking fuel injectors, funny handling, hard starting and flaming out without a remap and of course for offroad the tiny fuel tank.

i can get either bike, with low hours (less then 20) for the same price (around $6000 aus)

or there's a few KX-f and RM-z 450's around a little more money, but i know the KX's are a good thing reliability and engine performance wise, just not so great turning, while the RM-z is excellent in terms of handling, but i know the 2010 RM-z's had some bearing issues early on, would either of these be a better option for what i plan to do.

whatever i get will be setting a rekluse and suspension work.

Edited by Ttoks
poorly worded quesion

I have a 09 and ride woods and MX I love my bike. Past bikes crf450r 2002, and crf450r 2007. The 09 took a while to get use to but I'm fast on it than my 07. I would say Rekluse.

no one has anything?

I love my '08 for off-road but have never even seen an '09. You might need to do some stuff to prevent overheating like I did though.

I just won a VetB harescramble this weekend on my 04, and have an 08 fully woods prepped but waiting on softer fork springs. I rode a friends 09, admittadly it was set up for mx, but we weigh the same and Factory COnnection does his suspension and the lower link before he even rode it to break in.. As some stated earlier, the FI bikes "take getting used to". The carbed bikes are much smoother from closed to open throttle (a bit, not WFO even). Personally? i would stick with arguably the best crf out there.. the 08. Not sure what your weight is, but the .47 springs are rough for woods/harescramble duty. I have .44 in my 04 and in SOME stuff, the 08 with the .47 is better.. deeper sand, fast sandy whoops.. When the fields are 5th gear and a bit rough, and 1.5 hours into the hare scramble and your going over palmetto roots, the .47 would be NO fun. needless to say, i rode my tried n' true 04 vs. the 08..

But you SHOULD try to RIDE both the 08 and 09 if you get the chance. They are different. Some love the 09, some love the 08 more..

I found $99 oversized radiators for the 08 through Zero-point Cooling, Engine ice, Devol rad guards and skid plate, UFO bark busters, Works connection clutch perch, 1.6bar OUtlaw rad cap, RaceTech valving with softer fork springs, EBC organic pads (red ones, less heat transfer), and my 08 is woods ready. I have a 13oz trail tech FWW im installing this week, no stalling issues, just would like a little more engine mass so i can not worry about lower rpm stalls.. THe 08 has a lighter balancer than earlier models, and a different pipe than the 04 i have.

I just won a VetB harescramble this weekend on my 04, and have an 08 fully woods prepped but waiting on softer fork springs. I rode a friends 09, admittadly it was set up for mx, but we weigh the same and Factory COnnection does his suspension and the lower link before he even rode it to break in.. As some stated earlier, the FI bikes "take getting used to". The carbed bikes are much smoother from closed to open throttle (a bit, not WFO even). Personally? i would stick with arguably the best crf out there.. the 08. Not sure what your weight is, but the .47 springs are rough for woods/harescramble duty. I have .44 in my 04 and in SOME stuff, the 08 with the .47 is better.. deeper sand, fast sandy whoops.. When the fields are 5th gear and a bit rough, and 1.5 hours into the hare scramble and your going over palmetto roots, the .47 would be NO fun. needless to say, i rode my tried n' true 04 vs. the 08..

But you SHOULD try to RIDE both the 08 and 09 if you get the chance. They are different. Some love the 09, some love the 08 more..

I found $99 oversized radiators for the 08 through Zero-point Cooling, Engine ice, Devol rad guards and skid plate, UFO bark busters, Works connection clutch perch, 1.6bar OUtlaw rad cap, RaceTech valving with softer fork springs, EBC organic pads (red ones, less heat transfer), and my 08 is woods ready. I have a 13oz trail tech FWW im installing this week, no stalling issues, just would like a little more engine mass so i can not worry about lower rpm stalls.. THe 08 has a lighter balancer than earlier models, and a different pipe than the 04 i have.

now this is the sort of info i'm after i'm only around 160 pounds, i usualy run .42 fork springs in my offroad bikes (although i have .40's in my 125), bu thanks for the info mate.

i'm starting to think that a CRF isn't going to be my ideal bike, the KX an RM-z are looking like a better option for me, EFI for me is quite important due to the terain i ride involving some very technical tight stuff where the bike often ends up upside down, everyone of my carby 4t's end's up flooded and taking ages to start and more energy then i can spare.

cheer's mate.

Love my '09 for motocross - best bike I have ridden/owned for track. However, I wouldn't remotely consider using it for offroad. Given your choices, I'd choose the '08 for that application.

now this is the sort of info i'm after i'm only around 160 pounds, i usualy run .42 fork springs in my offroad bikes (although i have .40's in my 125), bu thanks for the info mate.

i'm starting to think that a CRF isn't going to be my ideal bike, the KX an RM-z are looking like a better option for me, EFI for me is quite important due to the terain i ride involving some very technical tight stuff where the bike often ends up upside down, everyone of my carby 4t's end's up flooded and taking ages to start and more energy then i can spare.

cheer's mate.

I'm a 165 or so, at times after a race weekend i have a couple pizza's and a few extra beer so creep to 170lb..LOL. If your riding more technical stuff, hilly trails, etc. I bet the softer springs your runnig would be more ideal than the .44 im using. I would also get the oil level down around 350ml .. I bottom the .44 a bunch at that level however, and use 380ml and after this last race, my zip tie (crude gauge but works) was just off the bottom.. so about perfect for me.

May like a softer shock spring too? For our faster more open course with both tight stuff, and some fast. (this weekend was 10 miles, and i was doing 21min loops or so, so almost 20mph average.). Obviously firmer springs are in order for our stuff here in FL, than tight hilly 1st-2nd gear slower stuff. :smirk:

I would say a crf250 would be more in line for that??

As Pace said in the above post, my buddy LOVES his FI bike for MX and is pretty fast.. Way higher throttle position (lots of 70-100%?)

Hey Melk-man,

Since we are in the same thread and all... what have you done to your forks? I have stiffer springs in mine and thats all but I weigh in quite a bit heavier than you (260). I was riding this weekend and in some really rough, really slow spots I felt like my wrists and arms were going to shatter from the harshness coming out of my front end. On the smooth big hits they feel great.

Hey it's related...

Hey Melk-man,

Since we are in the same thread and all... what have you done to your forks? I have stiffer springs in mine and thats all but I weigh in quite a bit heavier than you (260). I was riding this weekend and in some really rough, really slow spots I felt like my wrists and arms were going to shatter from the harshness coming out of my front end. On the smooth big hits they feel great.

Hey it's related...

i understand your "pain".. LOL. I have been riding my 04 since 05 and revalved/sprung my crf450 bac in 2/2008.. We went with the RaceTech valving right off the website build program. You enter your weight, riding type, ability, bike model, etc. and it recomends a shim stack and spring weight. It has been AWESOME for woods/harescrambles. (little soft for mx).

Stock shock spring was good, 100mm rider sag, low speed almost ALL the way out, reb 9. low speed about 14clicks out.

Forks were too plush initially, couldnt' feel a thing..Went with 10wt oil on the outer chamber at 380ml, 5wt inside (freshening today in fact), comp and 7-8 out from full stiff depending (bigger changes the closer to full stiff ya get), reb is about 10 out. with the .44 springs..

However, i was not as impressed this last time when we built the "SAME" deal for my 08.. The bike is almost identical as far as the forks/shock are concerened, however there was a slightly different combo recomended, and the stock .47 springs were recomended.. (vs the .44 that we used before, recomended .45 at that time..). It said to not modify the mid valve as we did on the 2004 bike, Louie said this should have been done.. better for offroad. This change, and the softer springs, should get it feeling like the 04 forks. The 2008 chassie is SUPERIOR, much narrower feel, better turning was the thing i noticed right away.. the 04 will make the initial turn ok, but takes much more effort to FINISH the turns once you start to get on the gas. I could make some changes to fix that but short of changing to 08 tripples and fork stansions it may suffer in other areas.. It works great for now, so im leavig that bike alone..

I can say that the .47 springs even after backing the damping off makes for a much harsher ride when going a bit slower. Even after the RT revlave, my elbow pads fall down to my wrist when riding the 08.. but not on the 04. I think (and have read on this site) the RT spring calculater page might not be giving the right rates?? It recomends a .47 for me today, and even .48 depending on how i enter some of the parameters on the page (you would have to have one .47 springs and a .49 on the other side as i can only find odd rate springs). There is a tech AT the Race Tech shop in CA that does know his stuff, his name is louie.. Brad is just in "sales" and unfortunately is the guy you usually have to talk with, but is NOT as knowlegeable.

.47 is awsome in the faster stuff (for my ability and 165lb), and in the sandy faster trails and wooped out sections. But for offroad/woods it would beat you up in the slower stuff and going over logs, roots, rocks..

I have been riding my 09 450r for about a year and a half, 90% trail 10% track. I must say the FI is amazing. Power everywhere in the RPM range, no bogs or hesitation.

So far mods are:

Devol lowering link. Lowered the bike and softened the rear a lot.

Handguards, pretty much needed on every woods machine.

Yoshi pipe. Spark arrestor without power loss.

+17oz flywheel weight. It helped with being able to tractor more in the tight stuff, but really didn't slow how quick the power comes on. A Rekluse may have been a better option.

At 170lbs and stock suspension (minus link) I actually just soften the clickers a few clicks and crank the dampener full tight for woods and everything feels pretty good.

The bads:

The bike makes me tired fast.

The power comes on a little quick in the technical stuff.

Clutch pull is definitely a little stiffer than I like.

I have been riding my 09 450r for about a year and a half, 90% trail 10% track. I must say the FI is amazing. Power everywhere in the RPM range, no bogs or hesitation.

So far mods are:

Devol lowering link. Lowered the bike and softened the rear a lot.

Handguards, pretty much needed on every woods machine.

Yoshi pipe. Spark arrestor without power loss.

+17oz flywheel weight. It helped with being able to tractor more in the tight stuff, but really didn't slow how quick the power comes on. A Rekluse may have been a better option.

At 170lbs and stock suspension (minus link) I actually just soften the clickers a few clicks and crank the dampener full tight for woods and everything feels pretty good.

The bads:

The bike makes me tired fast.

The power comes on a little quick in the technical stuff.

Clutch pull is definitely a little stiffer than I like.

.. you can back the clickers ALL the way out, but the stock valving and springs for your/my weight will beat the shit out of ya in the woods/slow tech stuff (i doubt the 09 is much diff from 08 valving wise??). I rode my 08 for about 5 hours on stock valving (Racetech stuff was backordered).. took oil out, backed clickers way out..increased rear sag, etc. All that did was make it hard to ride in some areas, but did make me less tired.. I will say it was BETTER before with stock valving for SOME riding, like mx type stuff and deep sand whoops, etc. But i would get tired faster even with the clicks backed out .. softer springs are a must if your riding woods (imho). Considering your riding 90% trails, it is somehting you may wanna save for. WAY before a recluse.. suspension is where it is at man..

As far as clutch pull, move the clutch perch IN, toward teh crossbar more, adjust the screw that moves the LEVER toward your had some. I got a works connection perch.. ball bearings baby.. Much smoother clutch action.

I bought mine used with a Magura hydraulic clutch already installed. I don't know what I would do without it. Actually I do-get arm pump and crash more.

Thanks Melk-man. I am starting to agree with you that suspension is where it's at. I am kind of at an end point money-wise on the bike (or so the wife tells me) so I am thinking of trying the modified shim stack on one of these threads I saw. He took a shim out and apparently got a huge improvement in the midrange. Then I am going to basically start with your settings and some fresh oil and go from there. I have .50 racetech springs and a 6kg in the rear but like I said, I am 260 pounds.

I bought mine used with a Magura hydraulic clutch already installed. I don't know what I would do without it. Actually I do-get arm pump and crash more.

Thanks Melk-man. I am starting to agree with you that suspension is where it's at. I am kind of at an end point money-wise on the bike (or so the wife tells me) so I am thinking of trying the modified shim stack on one of these threads I saw. He took a shim out and apparently got a huge improvement in the midrange. Then I am going to basically start with your settings and some fresh oil and go from there. I have .50 racetech springs and a 6kg in the rear but like I said, I am 260 pounds.

yes, im sure there are shim stacks floating around that will be more trail/woods friendly.. don't overlook the possibility of softer springs even for being "big boned" :smirk: It can make a major diff in how your arms feel. Talk with the guys at race tech. Even .47 would feel big time different on the front but might be way too soft? im not an expert on that, i do know that .47 is too stiff for woods for me at 160 even though fairly quick on the trails. Nice for mx, not so much for woods. .50 may be spot on, you just need the valving change and a "refresh". The forks need done way more often than the shock (forks move at a 1:1 ratio to the trail surface, shock doesn't due to linkage reduction..and way more surface area on the fork tubes for contamination to enter.. I had my shock serviced recently, the "gold" valve was no longer even gold (it had been a bit TOO long since the last service).

The thing i find with many riders too, is they are almost afraid to try major clicker changes.. Take a few mintues before your next ride and (if you have not done so already) write down all yoru clicker positions. Forks and shock. This way you can always go back to this as a baseline. But then, take 5 clicks of compression out and see what it feels like, mabye try adding or removing something else.. Keep in mind 1 change at a time is ideal, but i keep a screwdriver and a couple wrenches in my camelback just so i can make changes every 10 min or so.. :smirk: happy ridin. !

Yeah, I really do need to get more serious about my suspension for sure. I just get caught up in the riding and do all my maintenance and adjustments in the garage...

I have one more quick question while I have your ear. How much Rotella do you put in each side of your '08? In my searches I have found some very varied (!) answers. What weight do you like?

Thanks Melk,

Dan

Yeah, I really do need to get more serious about my suspension for sure. I just get caught up in the riding and do all my maintenance and adjustments in the garage...

I have one more quick question while I have your ear. How much Rotella do you put in each side of your '08? In my searches I have found some very varied (!) answers. What weight do you like?

Thanks Melk,

Dan

I get the blue jug Rotella, a couple at a time having to ride 5.5hrs average a week. (poor me! :smirk: ) and have gone with CamP or Shawn's suggestion of about 700ml a side. I find the engine side "looks" clean much longer than my trans side, and usually end up changing the trans oil 2x for ever 1 change on the engine side.. And only change the filter every other engine side change. I get Tusk filters at RMATV for $3.99 per. I saved one of those 80/90wt qt jugs with the pointy filler cap and clipped the top so it flows out better, and pour 700ml into that, then squirt it into the fill holes (no funnel needed). I dump my used oil into used VP fuel cans i get from roadracing.. and take em to the local autoparts store for recyclin..

One main reason i would rather have the slightly "more" than 650 or whatever, is in offraod racin if you tip over and some goes out the overflow tube into the airbox, or like in my race prior to the last one (that i won :smirk: ) i had a rear valve cover bolt that was unbenownst stripped.. the bolt didn't come out, but it allowed a BUNCH of engine oil to spill out the top and down the motor over the 2 hours.. Although i lost some oil, when i got to the pits and the oil cooled i still had just below the "low" line. Had i skimped maybe it would have starved at the pickup occasionallY? ?

Great thanks, this is exactly what I was looking for. You da man.

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now