Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  

needle & clip--leaner & richer

Recommended Posts

Gonna give lots of info in case i missed something.

2001 yz250

was stock...ran ok except for blurble/bog off of idle and died easy, especially uphill

Installed JD kit and #8 slide

red #3position

main #172

pilot #45

made very little difference

(both setups----hardly any smoke, little to no spooge)

Went riding from 2850-5890ft elevation, ran like shit (won't run) until buddy adj idle and airscrew (he's smarter than me, lol). Ran good. 1st kick start when in neutral. Only problem was uphill climb would boooooooog. If I kept it on the pipe it would be fine, but lug it, and she would bog down until dead, no matter how much throttle. So I learned to feather the clutch, but there were still places I couldn't go because of it.

So I'm guessing it needs to be leaner? Would I go half a clip (blue needle), or a full (stick with the red)? And most importantly....which direction is leaner and which is richer?

*lastly, can i leave the main i have in because from what little i do above 1/4 throttle it seems fine.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Gonna give lots of info in case i missed something.

2001 yz250

was stock...ran ok except for blurble/bog off of idle and died easy, especially uphill

Installed JD kit and #8 slide

red #3position

main #172

pilot #45

made very little difference

(both setups----hardly any smoke, little to no spooge)

Went riding from 2850-5890ft elevation, ran like shit (won't run) until buddy adj idle and airscrew (he's smarter than me, lol). Ran good. 1st kick start when in neutral. Only problem was uphill climb would boooooooog. If I kept it on the pipe it would be fine, but lug it, and she would bog down until dead, no matter how much throttle. So I learned to feather the clutch, but there were still places I couldn't go because of it.

So I'm guessing it needs to be leaner? Would I go half a clip (blue needle), or a full (stick with the red)? And most importantly....which direction is leaner and which is richer?

*lastly, can i leave the main i have in because from what little i do above 1/4 throttle it seems fine.

It's a two stroke. There is no hill-climbing power at all below the powerband.

You need to be on the pipe all the time.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
It's a two stroke. There is no hill-climbing power at all below the powerband.

You need to be on the pipe all the time.

Haha...I had a feeling it was mostly me. Already starting to adjust my riding style. Still feel like the bike could be better thou.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

higher position on the clip = leaner check out the pic below...you can diagnose richer/leaner by throttle position and what needs to be changed in the carb...

His recommendations in the kit are only a starting point...sounds like you need to go up a clip on the current needle or to the 2nd position on the other needle provided (he should have listed an order to follow for needle positions from richer to leaner...such as red 3, blue 3, red 2, blue 2, etc etc...

5136692721_a923fcb8f5.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
It's a two stroke. There is no hill-climbing power at all below the powerband.

You need to be on the pipe all the time.

lol, you can chug up hills on 250's while not on the pipe. not the same way youre going to do it on a 4 stroke (and not in a true "hill climbing" scenario) but thats an exaggeration in my opinion. unless your just trollin' for fun and i didnt catch it.

ive been in situations in the desert where i hit some good ruts trying to climb a hill that threw me off and ended up chopping the throttle, and still made it up the hill without dying like the OP is describing.

to the OP, when going up in elevation you need to go leaner. check out my sig for an idea of how elevation will effect jetting. you will need to go leaner across the board. just in your ride alone you gained 3k ft. no youre not going to do the crazy almost vertical hill climbs on a 2 stroke without being on the pipe, but in most situations you should be able to casually chug up the medium sized ones in my opinion. essentially, you're drowning your bike. you said the bike originally was jetted stock (so i assume you ran with the stock replacement jetting from JD?). if what you have set up is close to stock you are WAY off at 3-6k ft.

im not familiar with the JD kit, is that the recommended jetting for that altitude or is that essentially a "stock" replacement?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
.....

im not familiar with the JD kit, is that the recommended jetting for that altitude or is that essentially a "stock" replacement?

It's close to recommended jetting for that altitude thou 6000feet is pushing it to far. (everyone in my party was experiencing some kind of power rob that high).

*When I say hill climbs I may exaggerate. 1 scenario is.....short hills I make it up a 1/4 to half...bogs down and I stop. May slide back a foot, but it isn't to steep where I can't get going again. Just need to rev the piss out of it and use lots of clutch.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
higher position on the clip = leaner check out the pic below...you can diagnose richer/leaner by throttle position and what needs to be changed in the carb...

His recommendations in the kit are only a starting point...sounds like you need to go up a clip on the current needle or to the 2nd position on the other needle provided (he should have listed an order to follow for needle positions from richer to leaner...such as red 3, blue 3, red 2, blue 2, etc etc...

5136692721_a923fcb8f5.jpg

Cool and...now that I see it...there was a part in the instructions about testing starting at richer...so maybe I'll try 1/2 clip and go to blue 3 for everyday riding around 1500feet +/-1000

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Remember that between idle and about 1/4 throttle that the JD blue needle is a little richer than the red needle.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
It's close to recommended jetting for that altitude thou 6000feet is pushing it to far. (everyone in my party was experiencing some kind of power rob that high).

*When I say hill climbs I may exaggerate. 1 scenario is.....short hills I make it up a 1/4 to half...bogs down and I stop. May slide back a foot, but it isn't to steep where I can't get going again. Just need to rev the piss out of it and use lots of clutch.

even with perfect jetting you start to lose power the higher in elevation you go. I would just lean the clip 1 notch and use the air screw method to determine if your pilot is properly sized.

jd will start you rich as he doesn't want to (nor should he) be responsible for a seized engine that was ran too lean to begin with.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
lol, you can chug up hills on 250's while not on the pipe. not the same way youre going to do it on a 4 stroke (and not in a true "hill climbing" scenario) but thats an exaggeration in my opinion. unless your just trollin' for fun and i didnt catch it.

ive been in situations in the desert where i hit some good ruts trying to climb a hill that threw me off and ended up chopping the throttle, and still made it up the hill without dying like the OP is describing.

to the OP, when going up in elevation you need to go leaner. check out my sig for an idea of how elevation will effect jetting. you will need to go leaner across the board. just in your ride alone you gained 3k ft. no youre not going to do the crazy almost vertical hill climbs on a 2 stroke without being on the pipe, but in most situations you should be able to casually chug up the medium sized ones in my opinion. essentially, you're drowning your bike. you said the bike originally was jetted stock (so i assume you ran with the stock replacement jetting from JD?). if what you have set up is close to stock you are WAY off at 3-6k ft.

im not familiar with the JD kit, is that the recommended jetting for that altitude or is that essentially a "stock" replacement?

He said the power stopped 'no matter how far he turned the throttle' which led me to believe that he doesn't understand the concept of throttle position and powerband.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

1 1/2 hours driving to riding area. Jumping on the kick starter for 1/2. 1 1/2 hours driving home....I really, really, hate this carburetor thing!

Remember that between idle and about 1/4 throttle that the JD blue needle is a little richer than the red needle.

Could this be why my bike wouldn't start? (except when towing then it wouldn't stay running). I disregarded this information and went to the blue since the JD chart said for next leaner step go blue. Maybe I should have just went a full clip on the red?👍

***edit

Installed the red needle with the clip one leaner. Started up and idled. Didn't have time to test it more, died when I gave it gas(probably just cold) and my foot is all bruised from kicking it for 1/2hour before. I"m thinking I don't like the blue needle.

Edited by inspects

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Clean the carb the power jet, set needle leaner, check float height.

Check the grounds on the ignition.

Make sure the gas tank is breathing properly

And make sure the reeds are sealing good

And lastly do an air leak check

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

turns out it was the float height. I tried messing with it and made it worse. Not a friggen clue on how to measure it (even after reading someones write-up on it). Over40rider took pity on me and took the bike home with him before I threw it off a cliff. I get to ride it this Sunday and see if all it cured:banana:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Reply with:

Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...