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Results from engine seize - dealership dealings

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Ok, so went back to the dealership today, they had the bike all torn down. I was unable to get pictures, but their story about the bike has changed. When I bought it, the salesman told me the bike engine had been basically rebuilt. Then, when I called from Missoula where it broke down, he told me the crank and piston, along with the rest of the guts, was all brand new. I got the bike home, dropped it off to the dealership, and now the story has changed. I went in to talk to the mechanic who tore the bike down, and he told me he was the one who "rebuilt" the engine, but thats not what he did. he removed the carbon from the engine, replaced the cam chain and guides, and just checked the rest of the engine out. They didn't really do a whole lot on the low end, almost nothing.

What happened to seize the bike is this: The bearings on the crankshaft failed, and the crankshaft itself seized up. Even with the top of the engine off and the piston exposed, you cannot wiggle the crankshaft. When the clutch is pulled in and the bike is in first gear, it pushes severely hard. All the gears shift, but the clutch is messed up somehow. The piston sleeve is worn and can be seen just by looking at it. The front sprocket has a tooth sheared off, the gest ground down from the sprocket locking and the chain still going around. Chain and rear sprocket are damaged.

Sorry, no pics. I couldn't get any and they didn't call me when they started tearing it down, but when I went in I made sure to take a look at everything I could. Nothing really looked that beat up on the top end, except that cyclinder sleeve.

The mechanic said the dealership would be willing to make me some kind of deal on getting me some other kind of bike, but I just don't think I want what they have : Hondas. I don't want one. I just don't like the things. And none of them are like the DRZ400, which can cruise highway, and be light enough to be good in the dirt. the 650 is a beast, and the 230 is a baby.

The bike: $2100

Gas: $150

Basic maint: $50

Licensing: $112

Total: $2412

Total miles? 700 ish. Thats $3.50 a mile, give or take a few pennies.

That doesn't include the seat I bought, or other accesories. that total? :$1264

That's $5.00 a mile.

Bottom line, the engine in the bike is screwed, and unless a complete rebuild of the engine and teh clutch, plus a thorough check over of the gears is done, it just isn't trustworthy. They want to cut some kind of deal with me i guess, but I don't know how to go about negotiating, or whether I should just push them to get it running. I was flat out lied to about the engine rebuild. The engine was at best tuned up, and at worst, cleaned. Knowing now that the crank and piston and all that were not brand new, I feel ripped off. I'm not sure what to do. I do have some thoughts on what I would like to bargain with them for though.

Thought 1: They pull the enigne, ship it to SSW, get the engine rebuilt and running super, have them re-install the engine. If I have to, work out a % to pay for SSW to rebuild it.

Thought 2: I buy the parts, they do the labor.

Thought 3: Part out the bike. Would I even get my money's worth for this?

The mechanic tried telling me that taking the bike out on the highway for over 150 miles is not what the bike was designed for, which is bullshit. he said riding "that high of rpms will just stress it too much" which is funny, because I didn't think cruising at 60 mph was that high of rpms, considering I find the shift point for 5th to be 50-55 mph. I hate to push them, but I feel it isn't my fault they made a bad deal on a trade in, and didn't want to fix it properly, and then sold it while it was on it's last leg.

What can I say, show, or do to show them that I wasn't using the bike wrong? to show them something more than jsut my opinion of the bike? and now I'm starting to ramble.

Any advice would be helpful. I've already called SSW, they do not have a used engine at this time, so that Idea is out. THanks everyone, hope your riding goes etter than mine.

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Ivan, you present your position very well. The mechanic is flat out wrong if he stated that you rode the bike too hard.....and that in any way caused this failure.

And it seems quite obvious that the dealer needs to bite the bullet and make you whole again....with a bike that is sound and as they presented it to be.

I don't think you can expect them to spring for the full amount of a SSW rebuild, because they probably think that they, the dealership, are a re-builder, too.

I'm thinking that they may need to receive some publicity over this event, no matter which way they decide to go.

There are lots of people watching this unfold.

Selling vehicles by deliberately misrepresenting material facts is considered fraudulent misrepresentation in my neck of the woods.

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I think you're looking at this with a level head. I wouldn't hold out much hope for the shop 'hooking you up' though. Sounds like they are already trying to shift the blame to you.

I would talk with the shop owner directly and try to bypass all the BS from the lower level management and mechanics. 700 miles is crap, and the dealership should step up to the plate and offer to do something to get you back on the road again. If they say they won't do anything I think you're going to have to cut your losses and walk. You might get back what you have in the bike parting it out, but it will take some time to get it all accomplished. Between here and ebay would be your best bets. Your frame if in good condition (with title) can be worth a few bones though. I see them sell for about $500+, plus the shipping charges.

I'll second your idea to get a rebuild by SSW.

Or if you can't afford that, talk with Eddie and see if they have any used cranks laying around, and such and rebuild it yourself.

I would still push for getting the dealer to cover at least part of it. Like free labor you buy parts or something.

Hope it works out for you

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Unless you have proof that at the time that you bought your bike, that it did have a rebuilt, then it's just going to be your word against the dealerships.

The mechanic is talking rubbish when he said that the bike was not made to do that kind of highway mileage. Theres plenty on here that has already done far more than 150 miles in one highway trip!

I think your best bet is to suggest that you supply the parts, and they use their labour to fit them.

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Tell them to give you the cash to buy yourself a new crank, and top end and you will not sue them for lying to you.

Take the bike home and fix it yourself with a stroker crank, big bore kit, and FCR.

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I’m assuming you have nothing in writing about the "Full Rebuild"?

By chance did you see the plastic oil pump gear?

Did you instruct them to wait for you to tear down when you dropped it off?. It sounded like you thought that was a pretty good idea when we suggested it... and that you were adamant you would be there.

Did they not honor that request?

Without a good inspection from a trust worthy Tech.. You can assume ever bearing, crank assy, bushing, and several transmission shafts are trash. If the Crank is seized from lack of oil, I'd look closely at the cams and head, as they are the FIRST parts that get oil starved, and will be damaged long before a crank seizes.

Then you have case damage at the oil pump, as it was not pumping oil.. as it sounds.

This motor needs a COMPLEATE tear down, before any decision can be made.. and a shop that is iffy is going to cut corners, reinstall questionable parts, which may last another 5-10-50 or 100, more hours, but in no way be worthy of using in a fresh rebuild

Your local shop is not likely to happily allow you to get an outside opinion, that your going to ask them to pay for.

If you have a sales order which states that the motor was rebuilt, or better lists the parts that were replaced, and it differs then what your being told now.. It’s time to get the advice of a lawyer.

And no, sorry, you’re not going to part it out and get your buy in cash recovered.

A Tact…. Ask them how much $$ they are willing to put in to rebuilding the motor (not that you will let them touch it) If they commit to $100, 200, $500.. Tell um fine, take the bike, all parts and ask for the check.. You’ll have it repaired elsewhere. Then buy a good used motor, and install. You may be able to sell the junk motor to Eddie, or heck if I was home, I’d give you a few $$ for just as a pile of test parts, mock up case, ect.. That may add a few $$ to your repair fund.

Or take it all, part it out, and walk away… knowing next time, if it’s not written in the sales contract, it’s likely a lie, or partial truth at best.

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Tell em "shit happens I guess." then punch em in his noggin. Nah. Jk. Or am i? That sucks so bad. Good luck is all I can say. My vote is don't settle and take em all the way. SSW motor at least if not money back or give you a used bike that YOU ARE satisfied with. I would be pissed at anything less from a dealer. Thats why you go to them and pay the big bucks. Even if used. They said rebuilt. And on top of everything it really wasn't. Right in the noggin'!

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Maybe I didn't read this right but if they are offering to give you another bike in exchange I'd take it!

If you don't like Hondas, take it plus your broken Z, sell the Honda and build yourself a bigbore engine with all the goodies.

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Maybe I didn't read this right but if they are offering to give you another bike in exchange I'd take it!

If you don't like Hondas, take it plus your broken Z, sell the Honda and build yourself a bigbore engine with all the goodies.

The mechanic said the dealership would be willing to make me some kind of deal on getting me some other kind of bike, but I just don't think I want what they have : Hondas. I don't want one. I just don't like the things. And none of them are like the DRZ400, which can cruise highway, and be light enough to be good in the dirt. the 650 is a beast, and the 230 is a baby.

I think they are offering a different bike, and I'd bet plus some cash, and THEY KEEP the DRZ.

But I may have read that wrong.

And you know, that not a bad idea... Take the bike with the BEST resale you can get them to offer, sell it, and buy another DRZ.

Your still going to be $$ down, it’s going to be a pain, you’re going to be pissed over all at the crappy deal.. But in the end you’ll have a new bike that runs.

I’m betting the shop is going to balk at any request from you that in any way takes the repair, replacement, out of their dealership.. Not you are bringing parts, not an outside opinion or repair, not any course of action that is not contained completely inside that dealership.

I hope I’m wrong and the dealership packs the motor in a cooler for you and send it to SSW on their dime, pays for a inspection and rebuild as suggested by the Lead Tech at SSW.

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There are so many case histories of DRZ400 being used for extensive highway cruising it is pointless to relate another one. Just briefly my 2000 DRZ400E in dual sport mode, all original motor ridden 2000 to 5000 miles a year for 10 years all over the western US is far from being used up. It is not my only motorcycle and it is not the one I choose for touring but it is the most versatile and gets plenty of 200 - 300 mile days. Some times you just have to run the highway to get some place and if that is 70 mph for 4 hr so be it. With dual sport gearing that's 7,500 rpm, not a problem.

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"A Tact…. Ask them how much $$ they are willing to put in to rebuilding the motor (not that you will let them touch it) If they commit to $100, 200, $500.. Tell um fine, take the bike, all parts and ask for the check.. You’ll have it repaired elsewhere."

That's my vote, and I would ship the engine to Eddie and let him work his magic. Most likely if you don't at least have a lawyer send them a certified letter notifying them of a pending lawsuit, then they are going to shaft you. You also have a good case to just ask for a 100% refund on the bike.,,,then go buy another one.

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if there was any kind of warranty at all on the bike when you bought it, i would push for a refund if in your shoes.

even if no warranty(as long as there is no contract stating "as is" or similar, i'd ask for my money back.

may not happen, but i'd still try.

the bike is basically damaged goods at this point with no way to trust the dealer to make it reliable.

hate to hear stuff like this. i had a feeling it was the bottom end.

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I hate to hear horror stories like this. I work in sales at a dealership. If you were told the engine was rebuilt then they need to rebuild it or give you your money back. Preferably get your money back. Id like to see what the Bill Of Sale looks like.

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caveat

emptor

Words disappear the second they are spoken.

Words not written mean nothing in a sale.. if this were 1950, ya a man’s word and a hand shake would be great.. in 2011 If it's not written on the sales contract.. it does nto exsist.

"But your honor, they said it was fully rebuilt..." Your Honor sir, this gentleman is mistaken, what he was told is, this bike is sold as is , just like the contracts states, and he was told it “Needed a full rebuild" The bike retails for XXXX, you'll notice that is more then what we sold this in need of repair, sold as is, example for.. We are not in a business to lose money,, we sold a used bike, needing a full rebuild, for a fair under retail price"

I hope I’m wrong, I hope they give you a full refund, or offer to ship the motor to SSW for a full rebuild.

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im happy to look at the motor.

Since this is probably what would happen even if they wont repay, whats a worst case full guts rebuild for the entire engine and transmission? 450BB, 41mm fcr, anything else you recommend? The stock cams are in good shape, but they are stock.

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Ivan, you present your position very well. The mechanic is flat out wrong if he stated that you rode the bike too hard.....and that in any way caused this failure.

And it seems quite obvious that the dealer needs to bite the bullet and make you whole again....with a bike that is sound and as they presented it to be.

I don't think you can expect them to spring for the full amount of a SSW rebuild, because they probably think that they, the dealership, are a re-builder, too.

I'm thinking that they may need to receive some publicity over this event, no matter which way they decide to go.

There are lots of people watching this unfold.

Selling vehicles by deliberately misrepresenting material facts is considered fraudulent misrepresentation in my neck of the woods.

+1

they flat out lied to you about rebuilding the engine. threaten court OR be willing to pay 10% of the cost for SSW to rebuild it proper. they obviousely are not trustworthy, but they CAN WRITE A CHECK.

if they balk, sue them. i would.

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