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50cc race machines

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so why is it that KTM is the only B5 company that makes a competition 50cc bike? i love watching the 4-7 year olds and helping them out when they fall and stuff but i cant help but be troubled by the full gate that is 100% ORANGE! so my question is- why don't the other four companies see the market in the little-little kids?

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Same reason the "big 4" won't build new 2-strokes.

Heads up Asses is the technical term.

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Same reason the "big 4" won't build new 2-strokes.

Heads up Asses is the technical term.

:busted::applause:

Again there are other Euro manufacturers and the US made Cobra.

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It appears the 50cc is a nitch market and the overall #'s per year doesn't have a big enough Return on Investment.

There are a few that make 50's

KTM

LEM

Cobra

Polini

Metrakit

Husqavarna

In a year, I'd be surprised if all combined they sell 1000 bikes per year. They are too damn expensive too. Almost 4 grand for a brand new bike?

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Don't forget that the kids grow out of them so fast, they get sold to another kid, then another who still races them.

This leads to not enough units sold to justify the extra development. Also lets them focus on the high-volume bigger bikes.

They used to make little racers; if it was profitable, they still would.

Edited by gsa102
More info

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Bud Maimone (Cobra inventor) told me they sold around 2000 50's in the year 2000 and that was the best it has ever been.

On average Cobra sells about 200 units a year. KTM probably sells a few more because more people are familiar with KTM.

The 50's the big 4 sell are basically the same bikes that were sold 20 years ago with BNG every year.

The market is smaller and combined with a crappy economy dirt bikes sells are probably at the lowest point ever.

Later!

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My son rode a dirtbike (1996 Honda Z50R) for the first time when he was 4. He is 5 now and I want to get him racing, but it looks like the season here in Colorado doesn't begin until March of 2012.

I purchased a used 2005 Honda 50...are you saying that when he starts racing he will be up against kids his age who are gonna leave him in the dust?

I sure hope not, because I don't see how I could have gotten an earlier start. He was riding a 2 wheeler when he was 3...so I never needed training wheels on the 50cc.

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If he races against other z50's he will be ok but if there's an open class with Cobra's, KTM's etc he will get smoked.

A Honda 50 has about 2.5hp where a Cobra 50 has about 11hp and my sons Metrakit 50 had 13.1hp.

There's no comparison to a playbike 50 and a race 50.

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I purchased a used 2005 Honda 50...are you saying that when he starts racing he will be up against kids his age who are gonna leave him in the dust?

Probably yes. Alot depends on the rider, but the honda is a heavy turd compared to the KTM or Cobra.

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KTMs, Cobras etc are 2 stroke race machines. The Honda 50s are 4 stroke trail bikes...apples and oranges. A couple years back I dumped a bunch of $ into a Honda 50 and built a pretty fast bike for my daughter when she raced open class.

Double the cc's(106) and at 12hp's she gave the 2 stroke race machines a run for their money!

It's for sale btw;)

037.jpg

036.jpg

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My son rode a dirtbike (1996 Honda Z50R) for the first time when he was 4. He is 5 now and I want to get him racing, but it looks like the season here in Colorado doesn't begin until March of 2012.

I purchased a used 2005 Honda 50...are you saying that when he starts racing he will be up against kids his age who are gonna leave him in the dust?

I sure hope not, because I don't see how I could have gotten an earlier start. He was riding a 2 wheeler when he was 3...so I never needed training wheels on the 50cc.

Not necessarily, sometimes the 4t is an advantage. It takes more skill to make the 2ts go fast. Up to a point, it is easier to go fast on the 4t, until you outride the suspension. My boy and I race HS, and the 4t would chug up the hills where the KTMs smoke the clutch like a freight train and overheat.

I would not let that discourage you from racing. There will be fast kids and slow kids. The only way to get faster is to get out on the track. And even then, you can't make them twist the throttle. They will when they are ready. Don't forget to have fun and take pictures.

and James Stewart and Chad Reed both started out on PW 50s

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Well in Italy for learning we used to take children a 50cc 2 strokes.

For the little children 3/4 years there is the lem 8" wheels or 10" like the KTM mini adventure:

cx1.gif

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Interesting....I guess it seems like an open class at 5 years old means you would have had to been racing at 3 and 4 years old in the 50 class.

Regardless, I'm not going to get discouraged...I'll just get out on the track, practice, practice, practice, make sure its something he likes...and if it becomes necessary to purchase a faster machine, than we will go that route.

Here in CO the race season starts in March....so just over 100 days away...woo hoo!

Myself I am 30 and just now getting into moto...and I love it! I'll obviously be racing just for fun...but I hope my son gets good while he's young.

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I suppose the alternative would have been to teach him from day 1 on a fast bike like a cobra or KTM. But it seems to me that it was better to teach him the fundamentals, shifting, braking, etc....and then when he is more familiar with that he can go faster as he grows into it.

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natural progression for today's competitive racers is usually a PW50 > (KTM 50 or Cobra 50) Jr then Sr> then 65cc.

in the past four years I have seen few polinis and LEMs gating up in the 50 class, its dominated by cobra and KTM.

With the lack of supply of these bikes, the demand keeps the price up in the new and used market. unfortunatly its how it goes right now.

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KTMs, Cobras etc are 2 stroke race machines. The Honda 50s are 4 stroke trail bikes...apples and oranges. A couple years back I dumped a bunch of $ into a Honda 50 and built a pretty fast bike for my daughter when she raced open class.

Double the cc's(106) and at 12hp's she gave the 2 stroke race machines a run for their money!

It's for sale btw;)

037.jpg

036.jpg

i did the same thing for my grandaughter built her a 4t 50. now i m building her a 4t 110. thank god i m smart enough to throw away the bills so i don t know how much i m spending. lol

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natural progression for today's competitive racers is usually a PW50 > (KTM 50 or Cobra 50) Jr then Sr> then 65cc.

in the past four years I have seen few polinis and LEMs gating up in the 50 class, its dominated by cobra and KTM.

With the lack of supply of these bikes, the demand keeps the price up in the new and used market. unfortunatly its how it goes right now.

What frustrates the crap out of me is Polini has a good bike but its the same freakin bike from 04, that would be like Ford still trying to sell the fox body mustang with the 302, great car but really??

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You could even ride a Honda CRF70 in the 50 class in some races and still be far behind. It does depend a lot on the rider, but you are not holeshotting anyone on a 4 stroke 50. And that is where a lot of kids get their wins because trying to catch up on a under powered machine usually only happens if the other kid crashes. If you are just looking to get the experience of riding in a race and the environment, by all means go with the Honda (basically no maintenance-unlike the auto clutch race 50's). If you think that is going to be discouraging and not worth it, look at the KTM. You can find them all over. You will need to familiarize yourself with the clutch, though. There is ton of info and parts for them.

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What frustrates the crap out of me is Polini has a good bike but its the same freakin bike from 04, that would be like Ford still trying to sell the fox body mustang with the 302, great car but really??

dont knock it, the corvette still has rear leaf springs. :lol:

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