Jumping Help!

[kx910]

Hello Gary Semics:worthy:, and everyone else,

I have a question that's been bothering me for a while. Every time I come up to a jump, I either stay in one position the whole time while in the air, but the bike always ends up going too far back or forward, or I try nudging back like on the Gary Semics tips, but that makes me go into a wheelie.?

I noticed that Ryan Villopoto and James Stewart kinda push the bike forward while nudging back slightly to straighten the bike out. I tried that and It worked, but I just don't wan't to do the wrong thing and wind up dead. Am I doing something wrong? Should I keep copying Ryan Villopoto, or just lean back and hope it works out?

Please don't guide me to a site, because I've checked the Gary Semics website, and It's not detailed enough for me. I don't have any money to buy any DVD's, so any free tips would be nice. Please just give me a simple explanation.

Thanks Everyone!?

[db330]

I wouldn't recommend trying to copy the pro riders as they are pinned till the very last second on the jump and need to push down the front to stop going nose high,

you just need to get comfortable on the bike, you say your stiff on the bike so focus on getting loose,

make sure you stand up, have a neutral body position (can vary depending on jump), ensure your holding on with your legs, when you hit it move around to move the bike, the more you it the easier it becomes, soon enough it will become second nature to you.

When it comes its all about seat time and practicing right.

on your point of going nose high when in the air you could use the rear brake to bring the nose down (not meant to be used to control but just when body weight isn't enough to push it down) if you can't learn forward enough.

[tye1138]

Getting over that stiffness in the air takes time. I'm working on that right now and its tough, you have to force yourself to feel comfortable in a situation that you naturally arn't. Even the pro's have a hard time dealing with jumps, all be it, huge jumps that we wouldn't ever attempt to do.

My tip is to experiment with different body positions and understand what each one does. Then try to integrate those into your riding on a more regular basis. Feel comfortable jumping and then you can try things like throwing a mini-whip or even a simple; taking your hand off the bar or something. Just a tiny bit of something that will help you understand that when your in the air, you do have control over the machine still.

Like everything, seat time is critical, the more you ride, the more comfortable you will feel.

[kx910]

I wouldn't exactly say I'm stiff. I move around a bit, and I'm in the attack position, but when I just nudge back without pushing the bike forward, it makes me wheelie. If I pin it in 2nd gear then nudge back, I go into a wheelie. How exactly do you do it? I just want to be able to jump right every time, not just half the time. I just don't want to enter another race, and still be jumping the wrong way. When I copy Villopoto, I feel like I have the most control over my bike. (I have a kx125 2 stroke BTW)

[kx910]

I wouldn't exactly say I'm stiff. I move around a bit, and I'm in the attack position, but when I just nudge back without pushing the bike forward, it makes me wheelie. If I pin it in 2nd gear then nudge back, I go into a wheelie, but If I don't do anything, it just slowly goes into an endo, and I panic rev to straighten out. How exactly do you do it? I just want to be able to jump right every time, not just half the time. I just don't want to enter another race, and still be jumping the wrong way. When I copy Villopoto, I feel like I have the most control over my bike. (I have a kx125 2 stroke BTW)

[450XJimDirt]

Have you tried shifting UP a gear ?? , going into 3rd will make the bike not as prone to wheelie then it will when in 2nd due to carrying the speed without the bike wound out into the upper RPM's , so you have more of a flat rise than a straight up launch , this effect is better felt on a 4 stroke , but you still should be able to feel the difference as well as you might carry a little more speed up the ramp so you wont be needing to throttle all the way up the ramp , just to the bottom and coast the rest of the way up the ramp , it will also level the bike out more being off the throttle than on it on the lip of the jump , just dont let off at the top or you will be doing endo's , wherever your throttle is at the base of the jump leave it there , so if your coasting , then stay off the gas all the way up the ramp , if your pinned then leave it pinned and you will have to rely on body position and (rear) brake tapping(with the clutch in) to lower the front

[tye1138]

I move around a bit, and I'm in the attack position, but when I just nudge back without pushing the bike forward, it makes me wheelie. If I pin it in 2nd gear then nudge back, I go into a wheelie, but If I don't do anything, it just slowly goes into an endo, and I panic rev to straighten out. How exactly do you do it? I just want to be able to jump right every time, not just half the time. I just don't want to enter another race, and still be jumping the wrong way. When I copy Villopoto, I feel like I have the most control over my bike. (I have a kx125 2 stroke BTW)

Well, I had a KX125 for a year and the gear box is so tight (ratio wise) that 1st and 2nd gear were totally useless for anything but super tight corners. Using 3rd gear and higher will help you keep the front down and using the clutch to modulate the power will allow you to stay in a higher gear for more of the lap then keep going down into 1st or 2nd. Its also a very softly sprung bike and its very light, so moving your body around will effect it.

If you wanna watch someone ride a 2 stroke, watch this:

[BoxcarWilly]

Well, I had a KX125 for a year and the gear box is so tight (ratio wise) that 1st and 2nd gear were totally useless for anything but super tight corners. Using 3rd gear and higher will help you keep the front down and using the clutch to modulate the power will allow you to stay in a higher gear for more of the lap then keep going down into 1st or 2nd. Its also a very softly sprung bike and its very light, so moving your body around will effect it.

If you wanna watch someone ride a 2 stroke, watch this:

best 125 rider of life!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[kx910]

yeah, I usually ride in 3rd gear, but at some smaller tracks I have to ride in second the whole time.

[kx910]

Have you tried shifting UP a gear ?? , going into 3rd will make the bike not as prone to wheelie then it will when in 2nd due to carrying the speed without the bike wound out into the upper RPM's , so you have more of a flat rise than a straight up launch , this effect is better felt on a 4 stroke , but you still should be able to feel the difference as well as you might carry a little more speed up the ramp so you wont be needing to throttle all the way up the ramp , just to the bottom and coast the rest of the way up the ramp , it will also level the bike out more being off the throttle than on it on the lip of the jump , just dont let off at the top or you will be doing endo's , wherever your throttle is at the base of the jump leave it there , so if your coasting , then stay off the gas all the way up the ramp , if your pinned then leave it pinned and you will have to rely on body position and (rear) brake tapping(with the clutch in) to lower the front

I usually ride in 3rd gear, I was just giving an example. Do you have any tips on coasting off of jumps? I've tried this twice, and both times I start to go into an endo. I usually only do this off of low, fast tabletops, but I see people doing it off of bigger stuff, and I don't know if I should only do this while going fast, or If I could do it while going faster. HELP.

[kx910]

?

best 125 rider of life!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

He's pretty good, but James Stewart Is DA BEST! Watch THIS:

AND:

.

It wasn't shot from any wierd angles to make him look faster, so just sit and watch until u absorb his speed.

To see somethin funny, watch this vid at 1:53

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mRnPBbneMGM

He hops like a bunny rabbit!?

[tye1138]

yeah, I usually ride in 3rd gear, but at some smaller tracks I have to ride in second the whole time.

Yea, you're saying you "ride" in 3rd gear. That's kinda scary to me, can you tell me which tracks you frequent? I mean, I use ALL my gears when I ride outside of 1st.

[450XJimDirt]

I usually ride in 3rd gear, I was just giving an example. Do you have any tips on coasting off of jumps? I've tried this twice, and both times I start to go into an endo. I usually only do this off of low, fast tabletops, but I see people doing it off of bigger stuff, and I don't know if I should only do this while going fast, or If I could do it while going faster. HELP.

As i stated , ramp and throttle go hand in hand with controlling the bike in the air , you need to keep enough speed to let off before you hit the ramp and not alter your throttle till you are either right at the lip or in the air , if you need height , then a blip at the lip (before your front tire leaves the lip) will send you high (you are already experiencing this by hitting it in 2nd which makes the bike more sensitive to pitch due to being in the power band of the engine so it becomes more sensitive to throttle input) , holding steady on the throttle will keep the momentum but not alter your attitude in the air like accelerating up the ramp would , but it will still point you up , but you should be able to control your pitch by leaning forward once in the air or doing a brake tap (holding in the clutch while lightly tapping the brake to adjust the attitude of the bike down then releasing the clutch and landing with throttle as normal) , sometimes just pulling in the clutch will be enough to change the attitude of the bike , coasting will do the same , but your distance will be slightly shorter , but if you carry more speed up to the ramp it works out the same , and the bike is more stable coasting , because the only thing affecting the bikes movements is momentum not lightening or weighting the front end by throttle input , this also works great when the face of the jump is weird or has uneven surfaces that will kick you sideways or rear up , so its easier to come out of it by simply giving it gas in the air and getting the front up , or weighting one peg to get the bike straight again , if your bike kicks left , weight the left footpeg and it will straighten out , just remember DO NOT change throttle position once you are on the ramp as that will give you the endo's or straight up landings that you can get from doing either on or off the throttle chops on the ramp of the jump

I am no expert in the subject by any means , far from it , just things i do to keep me safe as i am old and break easily , so i try to avoid dirt samples as much as i can and still have fun , so i pay close attention to what the bike does depending on the input i give it ! , so far it has kept me riding since the 60's , with only a few crashes in between , though i am no RC . and i am sure there are plenty here that are much faster and know more and better techniques than i do

And just so you know (though i am on a 450 4 stroke) i usually run most every track i ride in 4th gear

Edited November 24, 2011 by 450XJimDirt

[450XJimDirt]

HERE , this is how you should ride a 125 on a track

About half way thru this one it split screens , watch the clutch action when jumping , and note body positioning on both video's

Edited November 23, 2011 by 450XJimDirt

[kawi_125_rider]

Ive never been to a track, but the kind of jumps i hit (lips on top of hills etc) but what determines how you jump is speed entering the jump and however much throttle you give off of the lip. Like for instance i climb the hill in 3rd and burp the throttle at the top and the mix of those two things launches me and then i adjust with brake or throttle.

[tye1138]

And just so you know (though i am on a 450 4 stroke) i usually run most every track i ride in 4th gear

Yea, riding a 450 4 stroke and riding a 125 2 stroke are in my opinion, very different. You can get away with a lot more on the ramps leading up to the jump on a 450 4 stroke, IE: bilp it off the lip and clear huge jumps. On a 125, you've gotta be pinned up the jump face or you ain't gonna make it at all. So if the OP clears jumps at all, he is evidently doing that part properly.

But he might not have enough speed (because he is in the wrong gear) because unlike a 4 stroke, when 2 strokes run out of power, they don't tell you by hitting a rev limiter, they just stop giving any power. Its a strange feeling to be pinned and the thing just running out of juice. I've owned the same bike as the OP and it has a tendency to do just that a lot, its only a 18 - 25hp bike on a good day. Where my newer KTM 125sx has been measured at 40hp, so it never runs out of power.

[450XJimDirt]

Yea well the last 2 stroke i rode (consistently) that was mine , was in 1979-1980 (YZ250 , prior to that 1976 , a YZ 125 that i rode till 1979) so i am working off distant memory here , i know some aspects are different in how you are riding them , but the bike reacts the same (to a lesser degree than a 4 stroke) as far as in air attitude and how to adjust for it , but you can coast or not be pinned , you just have to ride faster to the jump to carry the bike as far (as i mentioned), but to correct attitude in the air , is basically the same , which is what the OP is having issues with , and it should help some with his issues as far as getting the front down without endoing

[tye1138]

Yea well the last 2 stroke i rode (consistently) that was mine , was in 1979-1980 (YZ250 , prior to that 1976 , a YZ 125 that i rode till 1979) so i am working off distant memory here , i know some aspects are different in how you are riding them , but the bike reacts the same (to a lesser degree than a 4 stroke) as far as in air attitude and how to adjust for it , but you can coast or not be pinned , you just have to ride faster to the jump to carry the bike as far (as i mentioned), but to correct attitude in the air , is basically the same , which is what the OP is having issues with

I ride the same chassis 4 stroke and 2 stroke all the time because some of my buddies have the same bike I have in 4 stroke form. Its amazing how much different it is to ride, totally, completely different. In terms of jumping though, the input you give a 4 stroke off the jump face, puts it in the right direction and it will go where you point it, regardless of how poor your body position is. But on a 125, it doesn't respond the same way, proper body position makes a bigger difference. I can rail on my friends 250F, but I ride it like a 125, with all the aggression of a 125 and the 4 stroke REALLY responds well to that. But it is a very different type of bike to ride and those Japanese 125's are even lighter then my 125SX making them even more temperamental to proper body position.

[450XJimDirt]

Yea that is why in the video links i posted for him to watch , i said note the body positioning in both videos , as i know body position has a lot to do with it

[BoxcarWilly]

?

He's pretty good, but James Stewart Is DA BEST! Watch THIS:

AND:

.

It wasn't shot from any wierd angles to make him look faster, so just sit and watch until u absorb his speed.

To see somethin funny, watch this vid at 1:53

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mRnPBbneMGM

He hops like a bunny rabbit!?

i bet jimmy d would whoop his ass