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Timing issue?

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Sorry for the newbie-type posts. Im still trying to get my 07 to start. I read the sticky on timing the 450 and after double checking my bike something looks wrong. When the timing marks on the crank indicate TDC my intake cam lobes are pointing forward, at like 8 or 9 o clock. The sticky said it should be rear facing at 2 o clock. Also upon further examination it looks like the cam gear is a tooth off. Would the bike even run if it was timed 180* off? The bike wont kickstart, but will bumpstart easy and run great once started. Im going to try to pickup a manual in the morning when my valve shim kit comes.

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Heres some pics to prove Im not crazy and not seeing things.

right side marks lined up

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/534/dscf3560i.jpg/

left side marks lined up

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/14/dscf3564k.jpg/

cam a tooth off?

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/638/dscf3565c.jpg/

cam 180* off?

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/195/dscf3566b.jpg/

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If you're in doubt, do the straw test. Works like a charm for me every time.

Take the spark plug out and insert a drinking straw. Turn the crank and as the motor hits TDC the straw will be at it's highest point. THIS is where everything should line up.

Don't try to remove the cam gear/cam chain with the lobes facing forward.

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as stated above, it is way easier to adjust/check timing with the spark plug out due to no compression. You can reach around with your left hand with an allen wrech in the crank nut and move the motor while looking at your cam gear timing marks. the straw or small screwdriver allows you to move the motor back and forth with significant precision to find TDC.

Your timing sure looks 180 deg off (lobes facing forward) to me and is likely why your bike won't start. I don't even bother with the left side/stator mark.

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I don't even bother with the left side/stator mark.

That is the timing mark. more often than not people get 1 tooth off and cannot figure out why. it is cause they are not using the timing mark. They decide the right side is the timing mark for the cam. It is for the balancer gear only.

Have you pulled the flywheel to make sure the key has not sheared?

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That is the timing mark. more often than not people get 1 tooth off and cannot figure out why. it is cause they are not using the timing mark. They decide the right side is the timing mark for the cam. It is for the balancer gear only.

Have you pulled the flywheel to make sure the key has not sheared?

don't bother with the timing mark on left as long as your using something down the spark plug hole to confirm tdc.. Either way works, i like something down the sp hole personally.

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Sorry for the newbie-type posts. Im still trying to get my 07 to start. I read the sticky on timing the 450 and after double checking my bike something looks wrong. When the timing marks on the crank indicate TDC my intake cam lobes are pointing forward, at like 8 or 9 o clock. The sticky said it should be rear facing at 2 o clock. Also upon further examination it looks like the cam gear is a tooth off. Would the bike even run if it was timed 180* off? The bike wont kickstart, but will bumpstart easy and run great once started. Im going to try to pickup a manual in the morning when my valve shim kit comes.

i am going to say this because everyone forgets. there are TWO top dead centers. one is your compression which is what your timing should be set to the other is the exhaust stroke. if you find tdc on ex stroke lobes will face frontward i believe. make sure when you have your tdc found that the valves are all CLOSED. then check and lobes should be rearward. tdc is either on it or off it make sure that it is dead on because it is VERY easy to be barely off and that will screw your timing. also when you mess with your cam chain the front side (ex side) of the chain is the tight side and the (intake side) is the slack(tensioner) side. when you replace the cam chain make sure the ex side is tight then use tensioner to take up slack. after that you should be good ;p. also make sure to time off second mark not first. that will cause the spark to fire before piston is tdc and your bike wont start and if it does it will run like hell

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yes, it's a 4 stroke, but the cam only rotates ONE time per cycle. the gear on the crank is small, the cam gear.. is big. crank gear rotates twice for each rotation of the cam :lol: If the dot on the right side crank gear is lined up with the case mark, that is TDC. You CAN and it does happen, that when people put hte cam gear on, they instal it 180 off, it's easy to do as the holes are symetrical..

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Good news. My valve shim kit cam today. I shimmed the valves, rotated the cam sprocket 180* plus 1 tooth. It fired up on the 3rd kick and once it got warm it starts on the first kick every time without using hotstart. Thanks for all the help and tips everyone.

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