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Anyone gotten revalve and it's not so good?

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I seem to see this a lot. People spending upwards of $700 for a revalve and it's not really that much better. Many times I read that something got better but another aspect got worse or stayed the same.

I'm worried I am going to drop my hard earned cash for what someone thinks is a good stack when it could be so much better.

What do people do in that situation? I'm guessing send it back but how many times can you send it back?

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Idk if there's anyone local that can do it, but that's always nice....so you don't have to ship anything.

Down here in Cali there's plenty of shops, but might not be the case for you

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I've been a customer of Factory Connection Since 99. They have a Canadian locale. (uh oh, not anymore) I've always ended up sending my stuff to them, ( 6 bikes now) Lately they've been Expensive though. Last 2 bikes cost $1000.00 a piece for a full on revalve/spring/rebuild.

Maybe cheapest would be call them, and or several other outfits:

You may contact Factory Connection - East (USA)

603-664-2221 phone sales@factoryconnection.com

And see what sort of vibe you get when asking them what you expect to get out of it?

Then, you either spend the money to find out, or keep what you got. Its about your only alternative I'd think?

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Sit down Son and let me tell you my story.-----------------------------Nah, we don't have time. :smirk: Just do your homework before you spend a dime. And EXHAUST every tuning option you can do on your own. Start with NEVER, EVER, NEVER attempting to measure sag alone. Get a friend to help and do it STANDING on the pegs(straight up and down, not hunched over the bars) fully geared up. :bonk:

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the worst suspension revalve that i ever got came from fc.i have since learned how to work on my own stuff,and its really not that hard.my best results to date have been with davej and his diy kits,and his suspension fluids.granted,i am a retired motorcycle mechanic,but in a shop enviorment you dont do much revalving,just repairs.if you cant do it yourself,try to find a local guy that will watch you ride and work with you.the thousand dollar revalves/rebuilds are a bit pricey,and sometimes they miss their target.just not on my dollar.lol.peace and wheelies!!!

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I had a Race Tech guy do mine and it ended up beating me to death , the bike was un-ridable unless i turned the compression clicker all the way soft

Since he was all the way across the country i did not want to ship it again (he offered to re-do it till i was happy , but the shipping costs and time down was not worth it) , so i decided to learn to do it myself , with the help of people in these forums *the Dogger in particular*, my bike is not 100% perfect , but its 98% better than it ever has been , it cost me minimal parts and time , and i actually am learning something along the way , , the time has mainly been testing and re-doing to adjust things , the time to actually tear apart my forks is less than 10 minutes to have the valving laid out on the bench

I am saving money and learning a skill that i thought was top secret and would never be able to do myself , the work is easy , knowing what shims to put where and why is the part i am still just starting to grasp , but i have more confidence on my bike than i have had in the last few years with it (after a very bad neck injury/break in 09 , everything beats me to death and made it extremely difficult to tolerate harshness) , the bike is finally rideable and i am slowly but surly getting faster again every time i ride because the suspension is now soaking up what i was prior , i am a firm believer that a properly valved bike can make all the difference in the world in your riding from a improperly valved one !

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I had a Race Tech guy do mine and it ended up beating me to death , the bike was un-ridable unless i turned the compression clicker all the way soft

Since he was all the way across the country i did not want to ship it again (he offered to re-do it till i was happy , but the shipping costs and time down was not worth it) , so i decided to learn to do it myself , with the help of people in these forums *the Dogger in particular*, my bike is not 100% perfect , but its 98% better than it ever has been , it cost me minimal parts and time , and i actually am learning something along the way , , the time has mainly been testing and re-doing to adjust things , the time to actually tear apart my forks is less than 10 minutes to have the valving laid out on the bench

I am saving money and learning a skill that i thought was top secret and would never be able to do myself , the work is easy , knowing what shims to put where and why is the part i am still just starting to grasp , but i have more confidence on my bike than i have had in the last few years with it (after a very bad neck injury/break in 09 , everything beats me to death and made it extremely difficult to tolerate harshness) , the bike is finally rideable and i am slowly but surly getting faster again every time i ride because the suspension is now soaking up what i was prior , i am a firm believer that a properly valved bike can make all the difference in the world in your riding from a improperly valved one !

:bonk:

I agree, learning how to revalve yourself is a valuable skill to learn. The mechanical aspect of it is a piece of cake. The hardest part is trying to figure out what shims to use where and all, but fortunately there are a lot of people around here that are able to help.

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Amen to that one.the safety issues alone are worth learning how to work on your suspension.i am a retired motorcycle/marine mechanic.i have been teaching my youngest son how to work on his 250f yammies,and its amazing at how fast a person can pick-up on this stuff and do their own repair's.not to mention the self-satisfaction that is derived from doing your own work,then going to the track and having a great result that you know you did yourself-PRICELESS.

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well, i've not had the bad experience of a bad revalve. but, what got me into this was seeing a major suspension company remove a few shims here and there, then pan it off as tuning. wait! that was years ago, and i'm still seeing that same shit now.

it really pisses me off that people can get "fleeced" in this manner. i am a motorcycle mechanic. i work on harleys/suspension.

if these fleecers did this to a harley customers' bike, they'd be six feet under. bikers don't want to let things go as easily.

the suspension industry could use a major "house cleaning".

Edited by GDI70

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I am pretty good with my hands and a decent mechanic so I think I am going to learn about tuning shim stacks and do the work myself. I have been in and out of forks with a 2003 kx250 that I thrashed for a few years. Just need to understand things that affect a bikes stance and handling and how these are affected by a shim stack. I am about to buy a 2012 KTM 150SX or 250SX (still on the fence about that one, always wanted a super light bike but worry I will miss the torque of the 250) but as far as I know the compression stack is housed in only one of the forks which would be great if I only have to mess with one fork. I really don't like the idea of spending that kind of money and having it be a hit or miss situation. Just rubs me the wrong way.

Anyone suggest some reading on tuning a stack? I really want to learn as much as I can about this. I have Patella-femoral pain syndrome and I desperately need plush forks. Too much harshness is going to aggravate my knees and make them worse and ruin my short riding season.

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@ gd170.with the technology not really changing all that much,i think that is part of the reason people get taken buy some suspension companies.the suspension is getting pretty darn good these days,and im sure its tough to be in that buisness.also alot of people are just plain lazy and dont want to learn anything,especially if it involves gettin a little dirt under the fingernails.but like you said,its basically the same old stuff.and by the way,some of our nicest customers rode harleys,as did some of the not so nice customers.lol peace and wheelies!!!

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I am pretty good with my hands and a decent mechanic so I think I am going to learn about tuning shim stacks and do the work myself. I have been in and out of forks with a 2003 kx250 that I thrashed for a few years. Just need to understand things that affect a bikes stance and handling and how these are affected by a shim stack. I am about to buy a 2012 KTM 150SX or 250SX (still on the fence about that one, always wanted a super light bike but worry I will miss the torque of the 250) but as far as I know the compression stack is housed in only one of the forks which would be great if I only have to mess with one fork. I really don't like the idea of spending that kind of money and having it be a hit or miss situation. Just rubs me the wrong way.

Anyone suggest some reading on tuning a stack? I really want to learn as much as I can about this. I have Patella-femoral pain syndrome and I desperately need plush forks. Too much harshness is going to aggravate my knees and make them worse and ruin my short riding season.

I would recommend going to the Honda CRF450R forum , there is a Sticky about a Do It Yourself Suspension Revalve by the Dogger , it starts out as a 04 CRF450 topic , but as you read you will find all kinds of bikes and setups and valving stacks mentioned in detail and with pics , i highly suggest reading those pages , there is more info there , than you would get from any book that i have seen so far ! :bonk:

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I seem to see this a lot. People spending upwards of $700 for a revalve and it's not really that much better.

there are some forks with issues that a tuner can fix. also some forks need to be adapted to the riding style, weight...

but I always wonder what a tuner does eg. on a Yamaha SSS fork that suits a rider nearly perfect in stock condition :bonk:

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when only some shims in the base valve are shuffled, to produce a junk stack that has multiple crossovers, and simply just blows through the stack. when that same type of junk has a stock midvalve (not touched). that tells me the suspension company charges way too much, for not only bad work, but lack of work. i've seen that too many times out here. they were charged a lot of money for a base valve re-shuffle. that company made claims about the product that were mechanically impossible with the type of work performed.

i've also seen very reputable companies charge a ton of money to simple work on the base valve stack. now, i know you can make minor mods and get good results. that's fine, but at the prices they charge for that are out of line. why charge so much?

it's a bummer to be at the track and see someone dissatisfied with a tune that cost them a bunch wondering; *** is going on here? it was promoted to be the polar opposite of what it is.

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My friend went thru that with his 2011 KTM 450SXF , he had it re valved by a local reputable shop (EVO) , and the bike was so bad he couldn't ride it without feeling like he was going to crash every 2 ft , and usually did , he asked me to see what i thought , it was like riding a teeter totter , you gave it gas and the rear squatted almost hitting the fender , let off and the front almost bottomed out , i weight 60 lbs less than my friend so i can only imagine how bad it was for him , so $2500 wasted as the guy was hard to get a hold of , and wanted to try this , then wait a couple weeks each attempt , all did not fix the issue , the bike worked better with stock suspension than what he did

So my friend went to NOST , and the guy talked to him , then met him at the track and did it right there on the spot , including machining custom parts right there in his box van , and then watched him ride and took it back apart , made changes , then rode the bike himself , adjusted a few things , and the bike is almost perfect , its so good , that i can get on his bike (again i am 60 lbs lighter) and the bike feels like it was set up for me (aside from the tall seat that hits me in the ass all the time) , my friend says he has never ridden anything like it , the bike floats over everything , and is like its on rails , and my friend can go to different tracks and click maybe 2 clicks and be good all day

THAT is how suspension should be for $2000+ , not a see-saw that is dangerous to ride

On another note , my friend took his older ( a few years ago) KTM 525 to RG3 , when he got it back after the 4th attempt to get it right , he hit a jump and both fork springs and the shock spring and the shock body broke , sending him to the hospital with a almost severed hand , broken wrist , concussion , broken ribs , broken knee , and kept him off bikes for about a year (it was a 100' table that he landed on the downside , just about perfect , and the bike just collapsed)

They charged him over $3500 for that fiasco

So just because its a reputable company , does not make their work any better than the guy that does his work out of his house

Not saying all shops are crap , its just i think a lot of them just guess , and experiment at the purchasers expense without truly setting the suspension up correctly for the rider !

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when only some shims in the base valve are shuffled, to produce a junk stack that has multiple crossovers, and simply just blows through the stack. when that same type of junk has a stock midvalve (not touched). that tells me the suspension company charges way too much, for not only bad work, but lack of work. i've seen that too many times out here. they were charged a lot of money for a base valve re-shuffle. that company made claims about the product that were mechanically impossible with the type of work performed.

i've also seen very reputable companies charge a ton of money to simple work on the base valve stack. now, i know you can make minor mods and get good results. that's fine, but at the prices they charge for that are out of line. why charge so much?

it's a bummer to be at the track and see someone dissatisfied with a tune that cost them a bunch wondering; *** is going on here? it was promoted to be the polar opposite of what it is.

Been there done that. Spent a bunch of money on a revalve and respring and was not much better. From this forum and thedogger's :bonk: thread I have learned how to revalve my suspension myself. I actually enjoy working on my suspension and it gives me more confidence when riding and I actually feel safer.

Not only have I saved money, I have gained knowledge and learning all the time.

If anyone has any mechanical skill at all, they should look into doing suspension work themself. IMO

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Been there done that. Spent a bunch of money on a revalve and respring and was not much better. From this forum and thedogger's :bonk: thread I have learned how to revalve my suspension myself. I actually enjoy working on my suspension and it gives me more confidence when riding and I actually feel safer.

Not only have I saved money, I have gained knowledge and learning all the time.

If anyone has any mechanical skill at all, they should look into doing suspension work themself. IMO

X2...Suspension shops try to make you believe they are brain surgeons, but all they are working with is $.15 shims and oil volume, ok and springs rates. Once you get into the internals, it's pretty simple and will save you a wad of cash. FC likes to charge and and a leg for what, I'm still not sure.:smirk::bonk:

At least places like RG3 can be affordable, but they all seems to have some flavor of "gold or "smart" valves so there's a few hundred extra that may or may not be needed. bottom line, learn to do it yourselves.

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what youre supposed to be paying for from a big shop is the testing. A sorted out, known stack for a particular setup ie. Vet 30 over novice at 200 lbs. Or Expert 160lbs mx only...very different setups.

Actually...lookin at it...probably only 4 or 5 shims different, spring rate and oil height difference between those two guys...

And some companies have thier versions or expectations of what those guys are and what they should be riding.

I had a big company do my YZF back in the day. Now...I dont look like Tim Ferry, but Im pretty damn sure it was stiff enough for him at Southwick.

Thats why I always say, before you decide to send your stuff off, spend at least one full day testing with the clickers. Find your best setup and give that info to your tuner.

If you really dig some weird shit like the fork compression at 2, the rebound at 14, with the rear high at 3 turns and the low at 1 with the rebound at 2...he needs to know that. You also may be doing the wrong thing with the clicker too...but the info is gold to the tuner.

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I;ve decided to learn and work on my own suspension. I read through the first 10 pages of the dogger thread but I didn't really learn what makes a stack and how a certain stack affects suspension behavior. Maybe it is further in the thread?

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what youre supposed to be paying for from a big shop is the testing. A sorted out, known stack for a particular setup ie. Vet 30 over novice at 200 lbs. Or Expert 160lbs mx only...very different setups.

Suspension is subjective and the riders personal opinion, even between two 160lb B class woods riders who prefer plush suspension. There is no *magic* set up for any given rider weight, style, terrain, skill level, etc. There may be known issues for a given bike but there are even major discrepancies in what spring rates to use for a specified rider in a specified application. Add regional terrain variations (sand, clay, rocks, tree roots, small slow moving animals, etc) and there are a BIG number of ways to make something work... or NOT work.

There are different theories concerning valving setups. Some people prefer to concentrate on the mid-valve (which can obviously have a major impact on the success of any given set up), some prefer to concentrate on piston design, port location and port flow. Everyone has had their successes and their failures- some better and some worse than others.

A tuners priorities may change and he may spend a excessive amount of time trying to make a poor set up function well. He may or may not succeed. I try to keep an open mind and try to continue to learn as theories change. I'm a born skeptic and want to know why something works better, not just that *it does*.

I always try to do a cost effective mod- sometimes that may include aftermarket pistons such as Gold Valves. Some tuners are very adamant about spring rates- I have the set up to measure spring rates and have been finding a pretty big discrepancy in some springs, new and used. Depending on the customers budget, I might recommend leaving both ends equally soft (rate-wise) versus having fork springs that are too stiff and a shock spring that is too soft for a given rider. I prefer to try to keep a bikes spring rates as balanced (front to rear) as possible. Preload obviously has a big effect on suspension performance, as does the measuring method.

I've had customers who will have me do their suspension and I'll set the rear spring preload, explaining this is a good known starting point. Then I get a call a few weeks later saying they've done this or that and have it all screwed up due to their friends advising them on the *right* way to set up their shock or forks.

I've also had customers bring in suspension that has been *done* by someone else. The best you can do is try to use what is there and work with it. Sometimes you have better success than other times. Its a constant learning process.

There are a huge number of variable that are within a tuners control that can make things difficult to get *right*- add to that the huge number of variables out of a tuners control and it can be a nightmare at times. Obviously, every tuner tries to hit the bulls eye every time. Does it happen every time? No. The best we can do is try to do everything within reason to make it work.

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