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Trials skils make you a better offroad rider.

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I don't know alot about tials, but I know all the top extreame enduro riders have trials experience .

As a offroad rider and xc racer I realy think a solid set of trials skils that you can use on a big bike. What skills do you practice

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I fall down a lot. I've gotten pretty good at it. All the other skills involved with not falling, I need to practice. Troy341

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trials forces you to learn how to ride standing up

there's a reason all the fast offroad guys ride standing up

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Trials teachs you proper body positioning, clutch, throttle and suspension control and timing. It will also redefine what you believe are possible lines.

For me the single best thing to practice was figure 8's on the side of hill. Off camber ups and downs are hard to master but demand a command of the skills I listed above.

IMHO, the clutch is the most under used/miss used tool and the reason auto clutches are so popular.

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I really dont think a good set of trials skills makes you a better racer. Yes, maybe in a few areas they might help you be a better rider but in a racing enviroment, its more then just a few logs here and there.

To me its kinda like saying that if I play soccer, I will have better endurance for off-road. Only to a point this is true!

I think the only true and real way of being a better rider/racer is riding. If you look at a list of guys who are on top, their main advantage is they ride day in and day out. I truely believe that if anyone on TT was paid a years wages to just go out and ride all day everyday, bikes paid for, everything, within a year you would have a really fast rider/racer.

Racing is much more complicated. Just having the mental toughness to sign up can be overwhelming for some, hence why they never race. I applaud anyone who finishes a race because I know how hard it really is.

As for practice, I ride a lot of motos, 85% of my training happens on a motocross track because its more consistent then just riding around in the bush. I practice starts everytime I train, I very rarely practice hillclimbs, individual logs I do for fun. Practicing sets of obstacles such as rocks then logs, then a few jumps, then tires are starting to become more common due to the promoters putting small enduro cross sections in all the races now!

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For racing I agree. Most all races are held on pretty tame terrain. Trials training will definately help the knarlier it gets.

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I really dont think a good set of trials skills makes you a better racer. Yes, maybe in a few areas they might help you be a better rider but in a racing enviroment, its more then just a few logs here and there.

You might have a point when it pertains to Moto-Cross Racing, however, this is the Off-Road Riding Techniques Forum so what the others have pointed out is definitely valid here. In addition, your point is really only an opinion based upon limited experience..(no offense intended) and we all have them.. The only real way to know for sure is to cross the line and see for yourself.. And that is what many riders are doing today. The skills mix.. both directions.

Cross Training can't hurt no matter which direction you go..

There is a pretty good You Tube Channel that launched May 1 of this year. They have about 50 videos of various topics covering many aspects of off-road riding including racing tips and Trials tips for Enduro riders. Even bike setup tips.

By the name of OffRoad Fanatic on You Tube.. or here is the introduction video:

http://www.youtube.com/user/TheOffroadfanatic?feature=g-u#p/u/58/AuppYRVfIjo

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For racing I agree. Most all races are held on pretty tame terrain. Trials training will definately help the knarlier it gets.

Ever seen taddy B ride??? david knight? any erzberg winners for that matter who don't have trials expereince???

I plan to do the isde west coast qualifier this year in Idaho, Montana big sky xc and a few others and believe me there is no tame terrain in these races.

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taddy came from trials too? That guy rides standing up almost all the time

when my back decided I was done riding on my ass, the first few rides SUCKED, I was so sore and tired, but after 3 rides standing almost the whole time I got over that hump, and now it's easy

I would imagine getting on a trials bike would have a similar curve to it if you ride on your ass all the time

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You might have a point when it pertains to Moto-Cross Racing, however, this is the Off-Road Riding Techniques Forum so what the others have pointed out is definitely valid here. In addition, your point is really only an opinion based upon limited experience..(no offense intended) and we all have them.. The only real way to know for sure is to cross the line and see for yourself.. And that is what many riders are doing today. The skills mix.. both directions.

Cross Training can't hurt no matter which direction you go..

There is a pretty good You Tube Channel that launched May 1 of this year. They have about 50 videos of various topics covering many aspects of off-road riding including racing tips and Trials tips for Enduro riders. Even bike setup tips.

By the name of OffRoad Fanatic on You Tube.. or here is the introduction video:

http://www.youtube.com/user/TheOffroadfanatic?feature=g-u#p/u/58/AuppYRVfIjo

So were clear, I race off-road in Expert, with good results. I train on a motocross track. I came from a less then stellar motocross backgound. Limited trials background but a lot of bush riding. No offence taken!

Just because you good at a certain disipline of riding doesnt neccessarly make you a good racer, it goes so much farther then that!

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I can agree racing is 50% mental and 25% skill and 25% bike.

the reason i say this is because in racing the will to win and determination out weigh skill and even the bike you ride. you can have the best bike money can buy and have all the training in the world but if your not mentally focused and your hearts not in it you won't win races.

That being said, i also race off road gp XC in the expert class. i to have a moto background. the original post is about trials skills that cross over to bigger bikes because not all of them do!!

I have bean in many races that you get stuck in a bottleneck, you lose time and places. allot of times there are lines around the bottleneck that could easily be managed if you could say ride over a 3' rock with a square face. I have had very good success in off road racing and i just think there are times that the trials skills would help allot and make really technical sections a lot easier.

a few come to mind. rock gardens/bolder fields, log crossings,washed out uphills, you know when you get to the top of a hill and its about 2-3' sheer wall or rock at the top.

secondly i am not sure how moto training would cross over to xc racing. do you race off road gp, xc or hare scrambles? alot of guys can go fast on a moto track not many can go 40+mph on the singletrack.

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taddy came from trials too? That guy rides standing up almost all the time

when my back decided I was done riding on my ass, the first few rides SUCKED, I was so sore and tired, but after 3 rides standing almost the whole time I got over that hump, and now it's easy

I would imagine getting on a trials bike would have a similar curve to it if you ride on your ass all the time

taddy showed up to erzberg to race and was so fast ktm signed him on the spot.

here is some back ground info

http://espn.go.com/action/athlete/_/id/60384/taddy-blazusiak

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I can agree racing is 50% mental and 25% skill and 25% bike.

the reason i say this is because in racing the will to win and determination out weigh skill and even the bike you ride. you can have the best bike money can buy and have all the training in the world but if your not mentally focused and your hearts not in it you won't win races.

Well said!

That being said, i also race off road gp XC in the expert class. i to have a moto background. the original post is about trials skills that cross over to bigger bikes because not all of them do!!

I have bean in many races that you get stuck in a bottleneck, you lose time and places. allot of times there are lines around the bottleneck that could easily be managed if you could say ride over a 3' rock with a square face. I have had very good success in off road racing and i just think there are times that the trials skills would help allot and make really technical sections a lot easier.

a few come to mind. rock gardens/bolder fields, log crossings,washed out uphills, you know when you get to the top of a hill and its about 2-3' sheer wall or rock at the top.

secondly i am not sure how moto training would cross over to xc racing. do you race off road gp, xc or hare scrambles? alot of guys can go fast on a moto track not many can go 40+mph on the singletrack.

It transfers very very well into off-road racing. It is more common for a motocross guy to do well in a higher off-road class then vice-versa. Josh Strang practices religiously on a moto x track.

With moto, me personally, I can be more consistent with lap times, heartrate, bike control and I even feel safer due being on a one way course vs my HS practice loop in the middle of the bush.

I race XC and HS and the odd motocross. IMO, at expert levels and above (you could even throw a few intermediates in as well) you already have the skills, you just dont have the conditioning. I have ridden with many of the top pros in Canada and they're super fast, I can hang with them for a while but I just dont have the conditioning they do. But come to something technical, I can go through it just as well as they do, sometimes faster, sometimes slower. But over the course of 3hrs, I just dont have the stamina to go that much more faster.

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It transfers very very well into off-road racing. It is more common for a motocross guy to do well in a higher off-road class then vice-versa. Josh Strang practices religiously on a moto x track.

With moto, me personally, I can be more consistent with lap times, heartrate, bike control and I even feel safer due being on a one way course vs my HS practice loop in the middle of the bush.

I race XC and HS and the odd motocross. IMO, at expert levels and above (you could even throw a few intermediates in as well) you already have the skills, you just dont have the conditioning. I have ridden with many of the top pros in Canada and they're super fast, I can hang with them for a while but I just dont have the conditioning they do. But come to something technical, I can go through it just as well as they do, sometimes faster, sometimes slower. But over the course of 3hrs, I just dont have the stamina to go that much more faster.

I see moto guys who do well here in our gp races and a few do well in the xc but not many, i race a endurance series here we started last year, 2 6hr races 1 12 hr race and our 24hr race, i iron manned all accept the 24hr because i already made a team commitment, my typical ride consists for around 50-100 miles depending on who i am with.

Conditioning plays a huge part in your race finishes, not everyone can go flat out for 3hrs.

anyways back on subject.

what skills cross over well and how do you train and practice them??? On a big bike?

I have a good set already but always wanna get better.

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I have bean in many races that you get stuck in a bottleneck, you lose time and places. allot of times there are lines around the bottleneck that could easily be managed if you could say ride over a 3' rock with a square face. I have had very good success in off road racing and i just think there are times that the trials skills would help allot and make really technical sections a lot easier.

a few come to mind. rock gardens/bolder fields, log crossings,washed out uphills, you know when you get to the top of a hill and its about 2-3' sheer wall or rock at the top.

That was my point about trials training allows you to see lines that previously you would not have even considered and the skill to use them.

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