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A-Kit vs B-Kit suspention

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B kit uses the stock parts and replaces them with better parts or coated parts like the pistons and legs.

A kit usually is larger everything, different internals, etc

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The Original Factory Showa B-Kits from Japan were way better than the Frankenstein B-Kit that RG3, MB1 and FC are doing the original kits had the following

-Dark Kashima Upper tubes

-Kashima Coated Inners

-Kashima Coated Floating Pistons

-Works BaseValve and MidValve Pistons

-1-piece inner dampener (no peens like the OEM)

biktpeen.jpg

-DLC Lower Legs

-Hard coat Fork Lugs

-Red Anodized BaseValves

biktBV.jpg

-Basevalve and Midvalves Pistons Kashima coated and machines with different ports...

These are the same BaseValves that the A-Kits have. they came in the Japan B-Kits

akitvalves1.jpg

akitvalves2.jpg

The MidValves are the same...Kashima Coated and machines with different ports

The Shock was the same..

-B-Kit Body Dark Kashima Coating

-Factory Piston

-DLC Coated Shaft

-HighSpeed Adjusted was different also.

This is a Factoey B-Kit and A-Kit HSA

akitHSC1.jpg

akitHSC10.jpg

Now the A-kit come in a lot of different flavors

All is the same as the Japan B-Kit but..

-49mm Forks Tubes

-Larger BaseValve and MidValve pistons

-Some kits came with National Tubes

The A-Kit Shock

-18mm shaft

-Factory Piston

-DLC shaft with Check Plate in the shaft

akitShaft.jpg

-Larger HSA

akitHSC1.jpg

There is a lot of difference between the Factory B and A kits....and a even bigger difference than the b_kits they are making now and charging you way too much..

Hope this helped

theDogger

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I'm not very knowledgeable about suspension workings:

I'd like to see ti replacement of steel items. Shafts, springs, fork tubes?, anything else where weight could be saved,

It seems to me there is a lot of weight to be saved in the suspension department.

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I'm not very knowledgeable about suspension workings:

I'd like to see ti replacement of steel items. Shafts, springs, fork tubes?, anything else where weight could be saved,

It seems to me there is a lot of weight to be saved in the suspension department.

Not AMA legal, not safe.

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Here is my a-kit fork internals.. They came with National Tubes, MX Spring Seats and SX spring Seats

akit6.JPG

akit5.JPG

Here is the B-Kit Shock

bkit1.JPG

Three different type of spring seats..

OEM - SX - FC MX

seats1.jpg

A-Kit SHock HighSpeed Adj.

A-Kit-HSC1.jpg

The A-Kit shaft has a removable rebound jet that is tunable. It separates the compression from the rebound. So when adjustments are made the circuits only effect one circuit. So you can run less rebound and not effect the compression.

checkvalve.jpg

Here are the Works MV Pistons

aKitMidValve2.jpg

theDogger:thumbsup:

Edited by theDogger

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Wow, thanks guys. Very informative! I saw a few A/B kits for sale here and there and thought about getting a set. I rode a 08 with the A-kit and it was noticeably better than my re-vavled stock units.

So it seems that with the different variations of the A/B kits out there unless the person who is selling it knows exactly what it is its almost a crap shoot on what you will get. Am I better off taking the stock stuff and adding in some of the internals that will make it perform better? Which mods will give the biggest bang for the buck? This will be for a 06 so obviously I don’t want to spend more than the bike is worth.

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This will be for a 06 so obviously I don’t want to spend more than the bike is worth.

And there in lies the problem. By the time you get all the coatings and stuff done, unless you go straight to the process provider, you're over your value issue almost instantly.

You can get the fork lowers coated, but most wont do it unless they're new. You can get all your fork pistons and stuff coated and you may feel the difference, but all this is going to be completely dependent upon you liking the valve stack too.

All that A kit and B kit stuff is sexy, but you've gotta get it setup just like you would the OEM stuff. The B kit stuff might be a little easier to setup because the OEM stacks will transfer in a more direct translation. As opposed to the A kit stuff with the giant pistons. The piston flow so much more that the stacks will need more attention right out of the gate.

For guys like Dogger, that practically wash their hair with fork oil, its not a big deal. But if you're somebody that's more shy about tearing into the fork and shock to adjust the stacks and just want bolt on stuff...the Kit suspension probably isn't the way to go unless you've got a suspension guy that follows you around.

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Come on Shawn your killing me! My hair is not that greasy is it? I switched from 10wt to 3wt...

Here is my take on the suspension Kits...Other than bling the avg. rider is better off taking the time learning about how the suspension works and learning how to valve and getting his OEM suspension setup and working the best they can. I am not a fan of the aftermarket companies because I think that they are way over priced for what they offer. So many times I have helped people who think that there suspension is way to harsh/soft...when in fact really need to be stiffer.

Example: Had a Guy with a 2010 KXF450, 6' 200lbs Vet B Rider. He kept complaining How harsh and stiff his suspension was...At the track watching him ride and then checking out his settings here is what I saw...Bike was riding way to low in the stroke...in the harsher part of the stroke if you will...He had changed springs to the next lightest and clickers were anywhere from 20-24 click out...(OEM STACKS)

So I talked him into coming over and letting me get things setup. Here is what I did..

Forks:

Got the correct springs in .49kg

Revalved it with more low speed and opened the high speed up a little.

Comp:14 out

Reb:12 out

Oil Level:375cc

Shock Change the spring to 5.7kg and did the same added more lowspeed.

and opened the highspeed up a little and add some lowspeed to the rebound.

Sag at 102mm

HSC:3 out

Comp:16 out

Reb:14 out

Nitro:150 psi

(BIG CHANGE FROM WHAT HE HAD)

Springs: .47kg

Comp:20 out

Reb:8 out

Oil Level:350cc

Shock 5.5kg

Sag at 108mm

HSC:4 out

Comp:22 out

Reb:9 out

Nitro:150 psi

If I had the time I would post the stacks!

The next day at the track he was not sure that making it stiff was right...He did a few laps came back in and we made some clickers and sag adjustment and he could not believe how much better it was.

You see this is the problem a lot of guy do not take the time and really understand what is going on and effects the adjustment they really have...

So now having said that.......

Edited by theDogger

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This is all from my personal experience....not because I am trying to make a living! I am an avg. Joe that taught myself through hours of experimenting. I am proud that the Sticky Thread in the CRF450 forum has helped so many for FREE! I have got a chance to talk a lot of TT members on the phone helping them out. Some easier than other..(The one's that listen and follow directions because they start to get a understanding, not like the drug addict that is looking for a quick fix and then moves on if he can figure it out)

As far as the Frankenstein B-Kit that they are making now you can do the same and save a ton off money. The biggest thing in my opinion is the Coatings. Why? Because FRICTION is your worst enemy! Having said that you are getting ripped off sending your Forks legs and shaft in for DLC and being charge over 1K. You can get them done for around $450 if you know where to go. Now internally remember attention to details is most important.

Most everyone out there can benefit from changing oils and freshening things up. A lot of time most guys are still running the factory fish oil or it was never bleed correctly!

I currently have a Factory Japan B-Kit and 2-Factory A-Kit as you can see from pics that I posted....Do I need these kits? In all honesty NO! OEM suspension setup to work was just fine!

Just remember there is always more than one way to get from Point A to Point B! No one way is right!

There are going to be guys on this board that will disagree with what I have to say...But I am being HONEST as a I can. There is already enough BULLSHIT FLYING AROUND WASHINGTON!

Well that's my 2cents I could go on for days...

theDogger:thumbsup:

Edited by theDogger

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Oh ya one last word of advise stay away..far away from after market valves! Not worth the money and time. I have coffee cans full of them! :bonk::bonk:OEM Valves are perfectly fine!:smirk:

theDogger

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can i see the top pic of the A kit fork internals and how they go together that would be awesome. Beautiful looking kit by the way. Thanks

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the green national tube is throwing me off looks like a super long spring seat. That is what doesn't make sense to me.

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Yes you are right, the National Tube is nothing but a foot long spring seat. I have installed and tried these before, you remove stock seat and related cir clip, spacer, etc and then slip on the so called National Spring tubes which will fit tight to lower bottom part of damper...you also may need to get spacers made to fit between to get fork preload proper and also have to reduce amount of fork oil when using these Pro Circuit spring seats due to more metal involved displacing air/oil space. Just some things I learned working with Pro Circuit....Bill

Edited by TexasBill

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thanks again guys. i have revalved my own stuff (KTM) and also servcied a couple of CRF forks for freinds but that is abou it. its a learning curve for sure that i never found the time to become better at doing.

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Dogger great info on the differences.Who do you recommend sending to for coatings?

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