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California Winter Closure. . .

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So the Access Denied video got me wondering. I live and ride in the Stanislaus National Forest. The USFS enacted a winter closure in '09 which up until now has not been enforced by local rangers. This year they are being told by "their boss" that they need to begin enforcement. I was told last weekend that they are giving warnings for a few weeks then will begin writing tickets.

So. . . I'm pretty hard-headed when it comes to these things and I'm guessing will need to learn the hard way.

Has anyone here actually received a ticket for riding during the winter closure? How much of a fine am I looking at in my future? Will I be fined for me and then each of my 2 sons? Am I going to jail? Will my kids grow up fatherless and need to schedule visits???

Inquiring minds want to know. . .

Edited by Wheelin4

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I figure the $ I spend in the future on tickets for me and my kids will be what it costs to ride. You gotta pay to play.

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So the Access Denied video got me wondering. I live and ride in the Stanislaus National Forest. The USFS enacted a winter closure in '09 which up until now has not been enforced by local rangers. This year they are being told by "their boss" that they need to begin enforcement. I was told last weekend that they are giving warnings for a few weeks then will begin writing tickets.

So. . . I'm pretty hard-headed when it comes to these things and I'm guessing will need to learn the hard way.

Has anyone here actially received a ticket for riding during the winter closure? How much of a fine am I looking at in my future? Will I be fined for me and then each of my 2 sons? Am I going to jail? Will my kids grow up fatherless and need to schedule visits???

Inquiring minds want to know. . .

Well even though you may think you are playing the martyr by riding and getting a ticket for riding during a winter closure. you are actually playing right into the hands of the people we concider our enemy. Not only are you giving them more ammunition you are funding the local government at the same time. We all have to tolerate winter closures so long as they are within reason. If they arent then follow the correct channels to fix the problem. Revolution only works if a huge majority can come together towards a common goal......

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While we are at it, How much is the fine for getting caught riding off trail?

Has anyone actualy been fined?

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So whats "within reason"? Is dust as thick as summer. . . At the end of January. . .and being told we cant ride for resource protection within reason? A blanket closure from December to April within reason? Prohibiting the bird watchers from driving on a graded logging road in winter within reason? I don't think so.

I'm not at all against resource protection and do my share towards that end. . . but blanket closures when the conditions are identical to summer is BS.

Really, what do you think we can do about the winter closures? Do you really think ANYTHING we do is listened to or taken seriously?

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While we are at it, How much is the fine for getting caught riding off trail?

Has anyone actualy been fined?

Better question why would you want too. Just asking.

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While we are at it, How much is the fine for getting caught riding off trail?

Has anyone actualy been fined?

Really? Don't go there. . . .

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Well, not off trail, but off designated OHV trails. Many of the old-school guys on the site brag about riding where ever they want. Just wondering of anyone has knowledge of "what if you get caught"?

Real info of big fines would keep me on the designated trails.

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Better question why would you want too. Just asking.

Just exploring the National Forest. See new places. I'm not talking climbing hills off trail in a OHV area like so many do at Elkins and Gold Note. These violations in cear view of all are just asking for trouble....

Edited by NeoRider

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The problem is not the fine for the first ticket, it's what can happen after a few. The federal ticket used to be $175 for riding off trail. Don't know what it is for violating the winter closure. But whatever the fine is, it's not the max. I believe that these are written under title 43 and that means it's up to the judge as to what the toll will be. I think it can go up to a year in the can and a $100k fine. After a few jail time is pretty much certain. Not many can afford that kind of pay to play.

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Just exploring the National Forest. See new places. I'm not talking climbing hills off trail in a OHV area like so many do at Elkins and Gold Note. These violations in cear view of all are just asking for trouble....

Really? What difference does it make if it is in plain sight or not. Being stupid is just that. Thats the problem with some of our riding community. They seem to think that they are above everyone else. If you have this type of attitude do us all a favor and sell your bike and stay out of the forest, Your just screwing the rest of us out of our riding areas, Some of us give a shit about our sport and our riding areas.....

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The winter closures for the national forests were very controversial topics when the Travel Management Plans were being created. The problem with "weather condition" closures is the inablility to sign and close off only the portions of a forest district that are affected by rain/snow. Historic weather conditions were used to determine the typical conditions and thus the closure dates.

The Rock Creek area in the Eldorado NF is an exception because it has separate operating regulations from the rest of the forest.

Ride on

Brewster

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Really? What difference does it make if it is in plain sight or not.

Uuuu, the same reason you go 100 on your sport bike on a deserted road and not downtown?

For the record, I'm not stupid. I have an old plated XL350 and ride out Forest Service roads and explore every side road I see. After seeing that access video, clearly most of these are closed. I honestly figured there would be a gate if the road was closed.

To stay on topic - Talking bikes with guys at work, a group has been going to Foresthill for years and riding in the snow. They had no clue the trails ever close. There are ride 3-4 times a year guys that do not even know about TT. Typical deal for them - it's a beautiful day in Sac and they have no clue there is snow up higher. They get up there and ride reguardless of the conditions. They were rather bumed out when I educated them of the seasonal closure which I learned about here.

Guess igorance is bliss, I was a happier rider before I learned of all this drama....

Edited by NeoRider

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Uuuu, the same reason you go 100 on your sport bike on a deserted road and not downtown?

For the record, I'm not stupid. I have an old plated XL350 and ride out Forest Service roads and explore every side road I see. After seeing that access video, clearly most of these are closed. I honestly figured there would be a gate if the road was closed.

To stay on topic - Talking bikes with guys at work, a group has been going to Foresthill for years and riding in the snow. They had no clue the trails ever close. There are ride 3-4 times a year guys that do not even know about TT. Typical deal for them - it's a beautiful day in Sac and they have no clue there is snow up higher. They get up there and ride reguardless of the conditions. They were rather bumed out when I educated them of the seasonal closure which I learned about here.

Guess igorance is bliss, I was a happier rider before I learned of all this drama....

Believe me we had some issues last year about trail closures without any reasonable reason. We made enough a stink that the FS had to revert back to there old policy. My main point is that generally speaking they have a reason to close certain areas. Even if doesnt make sense to us casual observers. When some lamebrain rides the trails when they are closed it reflects badly on all of us. We have enough problemswith the radical enviros without giving them more ammo...

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The winter closures for the national forests were very controversial topics when the Travel Management Plans were being created. The problem with "weather condition" closures is the inablility to sign and close off only the portions of a forest district that are affected by rain/snow. Historic weather conditions were used to determine the typical conditions and thus the closure dates.

The Rock Creek area in the Eldorado NF is an exception because it has separate operating regulations from the rest of the forest.

Ride on

Brewster

Come on Brewster, that is the Forest Service's BS line that they use to justify their policy that is really based on convenience, opinion and politics, and I can't believe you really buy into it. Historic weather conditions my ass. Sure, they used historic rainfall data, or said they did, but they have absolutely no data that correlates rainfall to soil conditions, because they had no historic soils data. Without that kind of data they might as well been throwing darts at a calendar. They bullshitted their way through the entire Travel Management process, at least in the Eldorado NF, and I sat at the same table with one of the big shots from one of OUR national advocacy groups and listened to him thank the Forest Supervisor for working with him and selecting the seasonal closure that they put into effect, when everyone else on our side was willing to fight to stop it. WE GOT SCREWED BY BOTH SIDES!!!!!

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Come on Brewster, that is the Forest Service's BS line that they use to justify their policy that is really based on convenience, opinion and politics, and I can't believe you really buy into it. Historic weather conditions my ass. Sure, they used historic rainfall data, or said they did, but they have absolutely no data that correlates rainfall to soil conditions, because they had no historic soils data. Without that kind of data they might as well been throwing darts at a calendar. They bullshitted their way through the entire Travel Management process, at least in the Eldorado NF, and I sat at the same table with one of the big shots from one of OUR national advocacy groups and listened to him thank the Forest Supervisor for working with him and selecting the seasonal closure that they put into effect, when everyone else on our side was willing to fight to stop it. WE GOT SCREWED BY BOTH SIDES!!!!!

:smirk: and we got screwed by logging access road bulldozing our designated OHV trails over the hill side, while we can not build a small work around trail or replacement trail. :bonk:

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