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wwguy

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About wwguy

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  1. Sometimes my wife gets pissed at me because I make her ride a quad to carry "important survival gear", LOL. But not all quad terrain here is sissy stuff. Some of it is pretty sporty. Thanks for the kinds words about my photos. We do have some tolerable views at certain times of the year.
  2. wwguy

    Spring Identification

    I'm pretty sure that if the springs aren't marked the only way to confirm rates is to have them tested. I'm no suspension guru but from your description, it's my understanding that your issue is more likely to be resolved with valving than springs. Because they're compressible, springs are more weight sensitive than speed sensitive. Their primary purpose is to hold the bike up at the optimum height to best utilize the available range of suspension travel, and not to control the speed of compression or rebound through that travel. Thus the emphasis on setting rider sag to set the bike at 2/3 or so of travel, then measuring free sag to determine if your springs are a bit stiff or soft for your net riding weight. Valves on the other hand control flow of hydraulic fluid, which unlike the springs is not compressible. Thus the ability to consistently control and fine-tune the rate of compression and rebound damping. Generally speaking, valving is speed sensitive and not weight sensitive, so the opposite of springs. This is why both are so important in a properly tuned suspension. That's how I understand it anyway. I'm open to Much Enlightenment from others who know more about these things. FWIW I'm really happy with .46 springs in the Marzocchi 48mm CC forks I'm running on my 2016 Xtrainer. I'm 210 lbs in my birthday suit and around 240 lbs with full gear, pack, tools, and 2L water for backcountry solo riding. I also carry about 15 lbs. of chainsaw and mount over my forks. I'm running 320cc of 5 wt fork fluid. My forks have been shortened 30mm to fit my smaller bike (not sure if that matters.)
  3. wwguy

    Oil injection first startup?

    I honestly don't care if other riders remove their OI systems or not, and I've never suggested to another rider that he or she should remove theirs. (Feel free to search my previous posts for yourselves.) I fully acknowledge that the vast majority of them are probably providing sufficient lubrication for most weekend warrior enduro riders. My "ignorant" intent is merely to point out 5 key facts about Beta's OI: Some of them do fail, even if a small number, so there is some inherent risk in running OI. There's no performance or reliability gain in using OI. It's a rider convenience gimmick born out of the business need to comply with Euro 4 emissions regulations. Beta has never claimed differently. Unlike using premix, OI riders have no method to verify and/or adjust oil flow rate. So how do you know it's working correctly? Honest question. Engines that use more oil create better piston seal, resulting in higher compression and more power. Dyno results prove this. All risk of any possible OI system failure is mitigated by using premix instead If you're fine with all of the above then more power to you (pun intended.) By all means go ride and have a great time! I honestly hope you never have any problems! My only argument is with the uninformed that aren't aware of the above, and the idiots like Son and Eric72 who want to call me names and insist that I'm some sort of arrogant know-it-all for pointing these facts out. (Seriously... @Eric72, that "I would love to let the rear tire of my 300rr loose in his face" shit was totally uncalled for. Were you off your meds when you wrote that?) Like I wrote previously, I'm still waiting for someone to make a technically factual argument in favor of the benefits of OI. But nobody ever gets past "mine works fine" or "I've never seen one fail myself, so I don't believe you." If you've got some good info supporting OI performance or reliability vs. premix, by all means, please bring it and let's engage in some intelligent interesting discussion. Bonus questions: Why is it that no ranked pro Beta riders are racing on OI, much less winning with it? Why don't Race Edition bikes come from the factory with OI? Are they all ignorant too? Jeez... Sometimes I feel like Bill Murray in Groundhog Day, reliving the same day over and over again. Maybe I should change my forum username to Sisyphus.
  4. wwguy

    Oil injection first startup?

    Wow. Obviously, I struck a nerve with you. I'd like to reassure you that it's wasn't intentional, but I've got the impression that you probably don't care. It's tempting to respond to your name calling and spelling errors with some pithy comments, but I'll try to stick to the facts and civil discussion for the sake of others following this thread now and in the future. I never claimed to be a mechanical engineer. I'm a controls engineer, which is quite different. This Wikipedia description of controls engineering may help you to understand the difference, especially since it also seems applicable to the topic at hand. "Control engineering is the engineering discipline that focuses on the modeling of a diverse range of dynamic systems (e.g. mechanical systems) and the design of controllers that will cause these systems to behave in the desired manner. Although such controllers need not be electrical, many are and hence control engineering is often viewed as a subfield of electrical engineering." "The practice uses sensors and detectors to measure the output performance of the process being controlled; these measurements are used to provide corrective feedback helping to achieve the desired performance." (This is exactly the theory of operation behind electronic oil injection.) None of that makes me an "expert" on Beta's OI system, and I never claimed differently. But I am an expert in control system design and operation, and I've invested significant time using Beta's OI system, examining it, and communicating with other riders who've done the same. And my professional experience does provide additional pertinent insight, which I've tried to include with my comments and opinions. Something tells me I'm not getting a Christmas card from you this year, LOL. I've got no problem with you or anyone else disagreeing with me. As mentioned previously I'm only politely asking for those disagreeing with me to bring some facts or other data points to back up those positions. So far you're not doing so well in that regard, but I'm still open to listening if you've got something intelligent or insightful to share. If I'm wrong about something I'd honestly like to know about it. Regarding the "proof" you say doesn't exist regarding failures and reliability: Did you read the several firsthand accounts from other riders in this thread? Also, take a look at this year-old thread where I linked a dozen or so firsthand accounts from other riders, including one who got to take an ambulance ride for his OI troubles. EDIT: I just realized that I've already had a similar conversation with you, so I'm not holding high hopes for you to review any of this with an open mind. But perhaps some others may find the info useful, or at least interesting.
  5. wwguy

    Oil injection first startup?

    I apologize for incorrectly assuming that you were familiar with Beta's OI system. If I'd known that when I read your first post in this thread I'd have chosen my words more carefully. Beta's OI system is technically "electromechanical", meaning the oil pump and TPS convert electrical signals to mechanical action and vice versa. The OI components themselves are well-designed and manufactured by Dellorto , a well-respected Italian company that's been doing this for a long time. (Dellorto is also making the components for KTM's new TPI two-stroke injection system.) The primary weak point in Beta's application is the crudely designed electrical system supporting this obviously critical control system. If you're interested in the technical details behind why I'm so critical of the system feel free to check out this post I wrote in another forum a while back.
  6. wwguy

    Oil injection first startup?

    I don't have any "fears" because, as you noted, I've removed mine to mitigate the risk of running it. But I've been hearing and reading reports of failures for a variety of reasons ever since Beta released OI in 2015. I've been an industrial controls engineer for 25+ years, designing and maintaining electrical control systems a lot more complex and critical than this silly OI system. I've spent significant time reviewing and considering the components, design, operation, and reported failures of this system. The Dellorto ECU, TPS, and oil pump are professionally engineered and would likely work well in a properly designed application. But Beta's fragile and somewhat hokey electrical system design is anything but well-designed. Thus the frequently corroded and /or broken connectors leading to the infamous failures of the 4700uF capacitors and diode packs originally designed for printed circuit board applications. I admit that I probably overreacted to your post. I'm just weary of reading riders claiming blind faith in a weak system that they don't understand. To justify their faith in it they frequently use terms that are marginally "good enough descriptions for housewives watching a fake reality TV show about dirt bikes", which is why your post struck a nerve. Not paranoia. Solid factual information based on professional training and experience in control system design, extensive firsthand review of Beta's OI system design, and reading many real-world experiences reported by real riders who have suffered real OI failures. In addition to the issues already reported by others in this thread feel free to search through my previous posts where I've linked to many similar reports previously. Your piston failure analogy above doesn't hold water (or oil and gas, or whatever.) Piston seizure in un-oiled and well-oiled engines obviously occur for different reasons. After 3 years of going around and around with discussions like this, I'm still waiting for ONE rider to make a credible technical case for OI system reliability and benefits to engine performance over premix. Any takers?
  7. wwguy

    Oil injection first startup?

    LMAO because you're using this analogy to poke a sharp stick at someone critical of OI, when the majority of OI fans use similar ambiguously vague terms to support their blind faith in oil injection. Few of them really know what's going on with Beta's OI system. Those that claim "mine works great" or "no problems with mine so far" have no method to verify and/or calibrate oil flow rate at any particular RPM. (In part this is because there is no documented or other proven methods for riders to do that.) Best case they see some air bubbles moving through the oil line along with the oil, or notice some oil missing from the tank after a ride, and assume it must be working properly. Worst case if the OI system uses "some oil" and the piston hasn't seized yet some riders assume it must be "working as designed" (a technical term often used in conversation by non-technical people.) Complaints about "funky" operation are no less scientific and usually manifest as "I went for a ride today and don't seem to have used any oil" or "my warning light flashes sometimes" or "my riding buddies call me the Moquito Killer because of all the smoke and spooge that comes out of my pipe". Stuff like that. If you like I can provide a long list of the things that can go wrong with Beta's OI, based on things that actually have gone wrong for others, but that's not to say any of those things will happen to you or anyone else. Obviously, OI doesn't fail on the majority of Beta OI bikes. But 100% of the risk of it failing on my bike is avoidable by premixing, which in itself is sufficient justification to remove it. There's really no need to provide additional technical proof that something bad happened to me prior to removing it.
  8. wwguy

    Loose bolts.

    I've heard of that happening but have always assumed that's a basic new bike preventative maintenance activity, kind of like greasing the steering head, swingarm, and shock linkage bearings. This is on the first page of the owner's manual for the bike you mention: IMPORTANT We recommend you to check all the tightenings after the first one or two hours’ ride over rough ground. Special attention should be paid to the following parts: • rear sprocket • ensure that the footrests are properly fixed • front/rear brake levers/calipers/discs • check that the plastics are properly fastened • engine bolts • shock absorber bolts/swingarm • wheel hubs/spokes • rear frame • pipe connections • tensioning the chain I followed that recommendation on my 2016 300 and haven't had any problems with loose bolts in 200+ hours of riding, including a top end rebuild that required removing and reinstalling the engine mount bolts.
  9. wwguy

    Rear brake pedal while standing downhill

    Fastway pegs mounted in lowboy position help with this.
  10. wwguy

    18’ 300 race sputtering

    FWIW - When I mentioned using 91 octane in my previous post I should have clarified that the primary reason is that a couple of my other fuel-injected bikes require it. It works great in my Beta 300 too, but I didn't choose it for the Beta based on any previous issues with lower octane fuel. (I've only run 91 through it though.)
  11. wwguy

    18’ 300 race sputtering

    It's no secret that Beta has been a shill for Motul for a while now. They were suggesting Motul 800 at 60:1 for the pre-OI 300RR bikes, so the current recommendation is no surprise. I obviously don't know how you ride your bike but generally speaking I think Motul 800 has a crazy high flashpoint of 485F for most Beta 300 riding conditions. Alternatively, Motul 710 is rated for both injection and carbureted bikes and has a much lower flashpoint of 190F. 91 octane ethanol-free pump gas mixed 40:1 or 50:1 with AMSOIL Dominator or Interceptor has been working great in my 2016 Xtrainer 300 for the past couple hundred hours. Both have similar flashpoints to Motul 710. Here's my minimal spooge output after a recent weekend riding 12 hours of mountain singletrack spread over a few days:
  12. wwguy

    Beta 300rr Piston Size Question

    71.955 is the upper range of B and lower range of C pistons. The "A" piston is 71.935 to 71.945 mm. See page 81 of the workshop manual for your bike for a table of specifications and instructions for measurement. As you've already discovered, unless you've got the right tools and experience it's unlikely that you'll get an accurate measurement of piston, cylinder, and the clearance between them at home.
  13. wwguy

    Lectron TPS carbs coming

    I think you're probably thinking of this thread and maybe this followup post, both by the same rider over in another forum. After reading those I wrote Boyesen back and forth several times requesting actual measurements and never got any useful feedback. At least not enough to justify spending $180 to find out anyway.
  14. wwguy

    2018 300rr over oiling?

    I have no doubt that this is 100% true, or that there are many others like you, but it doesn't change anything I wrote in my previous post. You and your friends are assuming uneccessary incremental risk, and possibly sacrificing some performance, in return for a relatively small bit of perceived convenience. Statements like yours above make the same logical sense as saying "My friends and I don't wear helmets (or boots or gloves or seatbelts or whatever) and none of us has ever been seriously injured." While it may be true, it's not necessarily the smartest thing to do. The UK rider in my image below didn't have your luck with his first OI-equipped Beta. His OI failure resulted in an ambulance ride and some time in the hospital. I had a conversation with him over in the BetaRider.org forum last year after the incident he describes. He later requested his posts to be removed and then deleted his forum account in preparation for pursuing legal action to cover medical expenses, lost wages, and replacement of his smashed up bike. (That's why I redacted his name.) He was a relatively inexperienced rider and bought the RR as his first two-stroke because he was attracted to the convenience of OI. We never did hear back from him and I assume that he's either done with riding or moved on to another bike manufacturer.
  15. wwguy

    Lectron TPS carbs coming

    Yes, the Lectron is just a tad longer than the stock Keihin carb. The airbox boot has to compress rearward a few mm accordingly to attach to the Lectron. There's plenty of flex in the boot to do this, but it does push it back to the point where it rubs against the stock shock spring. Riders running this setup say it doesn't seem to be wearing away at the boot. Also, I've read that the greatest contact point seems to be when the rear of the bike is raised in the full raised static sag position. Apparently when the shock compresses the shock body moves slightly rearward. This hasn't been an issue for me because I'm running a Fox RC 2 shock. It has a smaller diameter spring. The spring is also shorter, so the preload collar is below the airbox. (See my photos below.) I don't understand his issue. The shock bolts are nowhere near the carburetor (Lectron or Keihin.) Interesting. I've never heard of this happening before (but I believe you.) I run both of my vent lines down through the shock dogbone where they sit on the top of my AXP skidplate with linkage guard. I've run my bike through many water crossings where both lines were definitely submerged and never experienced anything like what you describe. From Lectron's 2T FAQ page (bold font added by me): Q: How do I route my vent lines? A: If you are running two vent lines, you can run one into your airbox or to the top of your frame, and one down to the swing arm. If you are running a “T” set up, you can run two up high, and one down to your swing arm. No matter what, you need at least one running down below your carb. If anyone is interested below are a few shots of my Lectron installed on my 2016 Xtrainer with Fox RC2 shock. Here's a rear view taken during Lectron installation a couple of years ago. It's obvious that the shock bolts are nowhere near the carb. This view shows the tight clearance between the Lectron carb and shock. The Fox RC2 shock has a 1.88" I.D. spring. The stock RI6V and aftermarket Sachs or Ohlins shocks for Xtrainer all have 2.25" I.D. springs and are slightly longer. Here's a side view taken recently. Again no shock bolts, gas tank, or anything other than the shock body near the carb.
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